Parking lot roads I add disappear

by **reasonerc** » Sun Jun 03, 2012 10:33 pm

I've been trying for months to get some parking lot roads in the vicinity of 3661 Valley Centre Dr., San Diego, CA, added to the Waze map. Without these roads, Waze directions tell me that I can get to that address directly from the adjacent CA Highway 56, which is a controlled access road. There is no way I or anyone else will ever be able to get to that address directly from Hwy 56. The parking lot roads I added around that address did once make it into the Waze map, and for a few glorious weeks, Waze gave correct directions to that address. Now those roads are gone again and Waze is back to giving bad directions. Of course, I have no problem understanding how to get there, but for others using Waze to get to any of the addresses serviced by that parking lot and parking garage, getting correct directions sure would be nice.

I have added those parking lot roads yet again, and this time I would like them to stick around.

Thank you.

by **bigbear3764** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 1:25 am

Can you add a permalink of your parking lot roads so every one knows where you are referring. From the bottom of your update map, on the right is Permalink. Click on it and copy/paste it to the thread. Maybe the person who deleted it will tell you why or knows now why it is there.

by **crazycomputingdotnet** » Mon Jun 04, 2012 4:55 am

Also when you add parking lot roads be sure to only put in just the main roads and not every lane in the lot. There was someone who did that in OKC and some of the lots got nuked completely by other AMS. I am still running into that person's lots and I delete the unnecessary lanes, impatient people will select entire street and delete.

by **gettingthere** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 3:23 am

With all of the issues with the way that Parking Lot roads currently work and that they often cause more problems than they solve, I have been wiping out many Parking Lot roads throughout the San Diego area.

Via forums posts and some direct contact with Waze we are trying to get the issues with Parking Lot roads addressed. I an constantly seeing Update Requests where a mapped Parking Lot road is instruction Wazers out of the Parking Lot to make a left turn over a median.

I see update requests stating that roads are mapped where there are not 'real' roads.

As stated already, another issue is once one path is mapped in a Parking Lot other Wazers then want to copy google maps and go crazy mapping every lane and parking space, many with client paves, no confirmation, no junctioning, etc. It's easier to clear it all out. It's not with a huge effort to straighten it out. I would rather focus effort on the road network itself which still needs a ton of work in most cities.

Post a Permalink as request and I'll try to leave them alone.

Also, what source are you using to navigate to this location? Street address or POI search? If POI search, what provider are you selecting or the results? There may be other ways to work around this other than putting in Parking Lot roads.

I am not trying to put you on the offensive, just trying to explain how these roads may end up to get deleted and that there may be some other options to work around your issue.

by **gettingthere** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:15 am

This is a good example of mapping that is likely to get deleted. It would be great to have you helping to contribute to the Waze mapping. But please read the Waze wiki on mapping and ensure that:

1. You add a Country, State, City and street name (if there is one). If no street name you need to check the 'No Street Box'. This will change the roads from RED (incomplete) to the proper road color for a Parking Lot Road.

2. Ensure that there are end nodes on roads that don't junction to another road.

3. What is the purpose of this Parking Lot road? https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... s=66214551

4. As requested above, please confirm the source that you are using to navigate to this location. If you are using Google, try another option (Bing, FourSquare, Yelp). If you are navigating to a street address, that should take you to a spot on Valley Center Dr. If not, we need to see if we can get it corrected with Bing (Waze uses Bing in their back end to resolve street addresses to a GPS location)

I see that you have enabled turns - that's good

: Unconfirmed Parking Lot Roads.JPG (200.8 KiB) Viewed 701 times

by **gettingthere** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:22 am

Here is an example of a Parking Lot mess that is about to get deleted. Unconfirmed, doesn't match the layout, mix on invalid one-way and two way, too many junctions, doesn't junction to the road network etc. No value added to the map.

: Parking Lot Mess.JPG (63.36 KiB) Viewed 699 times

by **gettingthere** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:43 am

Here is another example of where the mapping is incomplete (no City name):

https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... s=66173026

In addition, Waze is very likely going to route Wazers to make a left turn onto Penchanga Pkwy via the Parking Lot exit to the west. Often I would delete this Parking Lot road as not to give Wazers incorrect driving directions via mapped elements. It's different if Waze isn't sure how to route you when you are not on a mapped road. Waze will recalculate if necessary once you get to a mapped road. But if the roads (or Parking lot) is mapped and the directions are flat out incorrect due to known limitations with Waze routing, that is likely going to generate an Update Request in the future.

As I have written in other threads, Waze needs to get to work re-working Parking Lot roads, turn restrictions from Parking Lot roads and other dead end streets that are navigated against do to their penalty being to low, and likely a solution needs to be in place to allow for proper U-Turn controls so that Waze can come up with a valid alternative route.

: Please turn left across the median.JPG (124.64 KiB) Viewed 697 times

by **crazycomputingdotnet** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:52 am

gettingthere wrote:Here is an example of a Parking Lot mess that is about to get deleted. Unconfirmed, doesn't match the layout, mix on invalid one-way and two way, too many junctions, doesn't junction to the road network etc. No value added to the map.

Parking Lot Mess.JPG

That one almost looks like it was paved. I have found out by experience that paving is highly inaccurate, and Waze always stops/starts the actual paving like 30+ feet after you actually start the paving. It does not work at all for small lots/jobs and even on bigger jobs it does stuff like that ^^^. It is a lot easier to just do it in the editor than to pave and go back and fix the muck that paving does.

50% of the time I delete those and move on, the other 50% of the time I delete those and put them in right depending on how busy I think the lot is going to be (Walmart / busy mall / office complex vs. almost defunct strip mall/mall.

by **gettingthere** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 4:58 am

Like other editors, I have gone full circle on this. Many of us thought that mapping Parking Lots was going to be helpful, get Wazers closer to their destination, etc. But as many of us have found out after wasting many hours mapping Parking Lots, it usually just doesn't work out as expected and often causes other problems.

Waze needs to address our concerns about Parking Lot roads, turn restrictions, and likely U-Turns before most Parking Lot mapping will be useful.

Regarding Paving - many Wazers think that is mapping! They don't realize it's only part of the job and in many cases not very accurate or effective. They incorrectly assume that they just did wonders for the waze community (while getting a few points) and think their paving is somehow converted into something that can be navigated. We can't put all of the blame on the Wazers that are trying to contribute. Waze needs to do a better job of communicating that there is more work to be done after paving. I know it has been mentioned before, but even an email to the registered email address of the Wazer after paving, with a link to the Editing Manual in the Wiki and a permalink to the area that they just paved would be helpful. Although there are much more effective methods for mapping than using the paving function. That should be the last resort vs. the option that every Wazer can find in their client.

by **shawndoc** » Tue Jun 05, 2012 5:58 am

gettingthere wrote:Here is another example of where the mapping is incomplete (no City name):

https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... s=66173026

In addition, Waze is very likely going to route Wazers to make a left turn onto Penchanga Pkwy via the Parking Lot exit to the west. Often I would delete this Parking Lot road as not to give Wazers incorrect driving directions via mapped elements. It's different if Waze isn't sure how to route you when you are not on a mapped road. Waze will recalculate if necessary once you get to a mapped road. But if the roads (or Parking lot) is mapped and the directions are flat out incorrect due to known limitations with Waze routing, that is likely going to generate an Update Request in the future.

As I have written in other threads, Waze needs to get to work re-working Parking Lot roads, turn restrictions from Parking Lot roads and other dead end streets that are navigated against do to their penalty being to low, and likely a solution needs to be in place to allow for proper U-Turn controls so that Waze can come up with a valid alternative route.

Please turn left across the median.JPG

Why will it route them to turn left, when there's a turn restriction in place?