Time based turn restrictions

by **chunkmonkey** » Sun Oct 28, 2012 4:31 am

I know Waze at this point can't handle time based turn restrictions, I have searched the wiki and didn't see a mention of the best way to handle these. I have seen a few user reported errors of Waze directing them through a non allowed turn. Yet this turn is allowed 21 of the 24 hour period in a day. Is it best to leave that turn allowed, and close the occasional error, or restrict it and force other all day routes?

by **bigbear3764** » Sun Oct 28, 2012 1:11 pm

It's been said that if it is only 3 hours in the morning rush, it is a judgement call, can go either way. If it hits 3 hours in morning and 3 hours for evening rush, then restrict it. When you restrict it, it will cut down user requests, but create system errors when people turn during off hours. I have been leaving a short RR segment not attached to any roads as a note that there is a rest turn 6-9 & 3-6. Keeps me from QW that intersection when the system flags pop up.

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by **CBenson** » Sun Oct 28, 2012 6:14 pm

The Los Angeles editors have been using small landmarks to record the time restriction. I've adopted that method in Washington DC. I'm wondering whether it would be worthwhile to standardize how we record this information.

by **bigbear3764** » Sun Oct 28, 2012 6:40 pm

If we can have a notes landmark that is a different color of Plots and gas stations, and doesn't show up on client. Then I would just have to make sure I have landmarks turned on. That's why I used RR. They dont show on client and dont have to remember to turn landmarks on. Someone else had the idea on doing it this way.

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by **CBenson** » Sun Oct 28, 2012 6:47 pm

I could go either way. The danger with either is that waze will change the rules and they will start to be displayed on the client.
Both have been used as annotations. Maybe this is broader question of what we should use for map annotations until waze gives a genuine annotation feature.

by **kaeoboy** » Wed Oct 31, 2012 8:11 pm

The wiki post that I've been following for turn restrictions guidelines is:

http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Best ... cted_Turns

Unfortunately, there are UR's filed during Giants games when turns into residential areas become restricted, saying "Turn not allowed".

by **therubinator** » Fri Nov 02, 2012 3:51 pm

kaeoboy wrote:The wiki post that I've been following for turn restrictions guidelines is:

http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Best ... cted_Turns

That guideline is interesting in that it says "best to err on the side of caution and allow the turn" - which I somewhat question. Recently, I've been caught out by several of these time-based restrictions and waste minutes doing U-turns and re-routing back into traffic against Waze because this "side of caution" thought it was something I could have figured out. The end result is I've wasted time, become supremely annoyed at the app and lost some confidence that it really knows what's best (and even figure it out after giving it some guidance by avoiding that turn).

Futhermore, if these turns are restricted for 12 hours a day (and the 12 hours of the day I'm likely to be driving) it seems that Waze should be able to figure it out...but it doesn't.

Until Waze can handle these time-based restrictions, my confidence is always going to be in question.

by **kentsmith9** » Fri Nov 02, 2012 4:50 pm

That entry was originally worded to "err on the side of caution and disallow the turn". On August 31 user Jhfrontz changed it to "allow" with the justification that the cautious information would be to allow.

Here is the original text:

Code: Select all: Waze currently has no provision for handling this type of restriction, although it is planned for the future. In a situation where a turn is illegal during certain times of the day (e.g. No Left Turn, 7-10 am, 3-7 pm, Weekdays), it's best to err on the side of caution and disallow the turn. This way, nobody will ever be instructed to make an illegal turn.

Here is what Jhfronz put in:

Code: Select all: Waze currently has no provision for handling this type of restriction, although it is planned for the future. In a situation where a turn is illegal during certain times of the day (e.g. No Left Turn, 7-10 am, 3-7 pm, Weekdays), it's generally best to err on the side of caution and allow the turn. This way, waze will always give an optimal route and the driver can decide (based on local conditions) whether or not to use it.

This change was noticed in October and Jhfronz responded for the motivation in this thread. It appears there was no resolution as to how to update the wording to recognize the group consensus.

I for one was confused by the word that to "err on the side of caution would allow the turn."

There are now two questions in my mind:

1. Does the group generally agree with the philosophy of the statement that Waze should give the best route and let the user decide if it is legal?

2. Is the specific wording "to err on the side of caution is to sometimes recommend an illegal turn"?

by **Mike-1323** » Fri Nov 02, 2012 4:51 pm

The lack of time-based restrictions on both turns and direction, as well as the lack of HOV support make Waze much less useful around here. The DC area is full of such restrictions and failing to recognize them mean that Waze can't be trusted to route through certain areas.

by **kentsmith9** » Fri Nov 02, 2012 5:04 pm

{I separated my response from my post above to not confuse the question.}

On #1, I understand most Waze users are commuters. As commuters they are generally on the road in the mornings and evenings. If turn restrictions are set to control and prevent commuters from using certain roads during their commute, then we should consider having Waze "restrict" the turn for the majority of the traffic. Having the route enabled for the majority of most users that cannot take the route does not make sense to me.

If that particular turn is for another reason not based on commuter traffic or it is a very short period of time, I would say to allow the turn. Either way I recommend the editor will need to decide, but I think we should give some kind of guidelines.

San Francisco is full of hundreds of URs mostly made up of complaints that turns are not possible (time based) when Waze recommends them. For the time-based turns set to disallow always, during the times those turns are are not allowed the URs pop up that the wrong driving direction was given. Either way SF is screwed for proper navigation without a Waze solution for this problem.

For #2 I disagree with the wording "to err on the side of caution". If we keep this basic recommendation to always allow the turn, then I propose we not use those particular words. If we all get to that point I can certainly make some proposals based on the final desire for this "best practice" recommendation.