Landmark - Best Practices US

Image This is the place to discuss issues that are relevant for locations in the US. For any other discussions, please use the main forums.

Moderator: MapSir

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby russblau » Mon May 27, 2013 1:38 pm

AndyPoms wrote:Well, there is a long standing guideline that we "do not map individual businesses", so that takes care of McDonalds, etc. The thing you need to remember is that Waze isn't going to say "Drive to McDonalds and take a left", it will tell you to "turn left on Main St", it does not matter if McDonalds happens to be at that intersection.


Yes, but the same is true of any landmark. It's not going to say "turn right at the Washington Monument" or "turn left at St Paul's Cathedral" either. And saying that stores are not mapped because we have a rule against mapping stores is, well, circular.

AndyPoms wrote:The Waze Champs, Country Manager & Area Managers actually do supervise the editors, make sure people are following the guidelines, and communicate with the editors. You should also be aware that editors that do not follow the guidelines and refuse to communicate with the Champs can and have had their editing privileges limited and/or revoked.

Fair enough. I was just trying to make the point, inartfully, that coordinating volunteers is a much different process than instructing employees.
Image Image Image Image
State Manager: District of Columbia
AM Northern Virginia/Washington, D.C./Sussex County, DE/Westchester County, NY
russblau
State Manager
State Manager
 
Posts: 2562
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:36 pm
Has thanked: 200 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby russblau » Mon May 27, 2013 12:31 pm

I missed the opportunity to comment on the proposed guidelines a couple of months ago, but I have two comments on them if they are still under review.

First, the whole document is a series of instructions in the form "map this, don't map that", without any explanation. That would be fine if this were an employee manual, where people who don't follow arbitrary rules can be disciplined or fired, but the purpose of this document is to provide guidance to a group of volunteers who are unsupervised and pursuing their own personal motivations. If you just tell them "don't map X" without explaining why, they will ignore if it they feel like it. At a minimum, this document needs some explanation of what is the difference between a landmark and a POI, and why it matters for mapping.

Second, given what I understand to be the purpose of landmarks, many of these guidelines make no sense. Why is the "historical importance" of a cemetery of any value in deciding whether it is useful to drivers seeking to orient themselves on the road network? Why are parks or schools, which may be located far off a road, more useful for navigation than a store or office building? A McDonald's at a major intersection may be a more useful landmark than a church that is at the end of a long dead-end street and not visible from any other road. Again, what's the reason for these distinctions?
Image Image Image Image
State Manager: District of Columbia
AM Northern Virginia/Washington, D.C./Sussex County, DE/Westchester County, NY
russblau
State Manager
State Manager
 
Posts: 2562
Joined: Fri Oct 19, 2012 11:36 pm
Has thanked: 200 times
Been thanked: 540 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby razor2k » Wed Jun 12, 2013 3:08 am

Nope, it's buisiness as usual. I have a gut feeling that Noam and the gang are true to their word and not much is going to change with us editor's. At least in the next 2 years or so. Hang in there guys!

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2
Area Manager: Pinellas, Pasco & Hillsborough Counties FL
Phone: Samsung GS 2, Sprint, Android 4.1.2
Waze: 3.7.2

Waze FAQ...Best Map Editing Practice...Correct Server?...User Manual
razor2k
 
Posts: 1392
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 8:40 pm
Location: Saint Petersburg, FL
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 54 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby razor2k » Wed Jun 12, 2013 2:58 am

TruckOttr wrote:
What I heard, very resoundingly clear from Ehud, was that he wanted more content. He probably wanted more content than the editors were capable of being comfortable (for various good technical and emotional reasons). So, debating about putting in POIs or not, deleting them, etc., seems a bit silly when the app could do well with more content, both that which shows on the map and that which does not.


Now that it's official that Google is acquiring Waze, does it make sense for us to either hold off or check with Waze to see what their direction and intentions are? Although this was discussed in May, it's quite possible that this will be changing with the acquisition, even with Waze remaining operationally independent for a few years.



Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2
Area Manager: Pinellas, Pasco & Hillsborough Counties FL
Phone: Samsung GS 2, Sprint, Android 4.1.2
Waze: 3.7.2

Waze FAQ...Best Map Editing Practice...Correct Server?...User Manual
razor2k
 
Posts: 1392
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 8:40 pm
Location: Saint Petersburg, FL
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 54 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby razor2k » Thu May 30, 2013 1:14 am

jemay wrote:If you only searched for LAX, you would have been routed to the wrong entrance to LAX (closer to the coast), so I have created a small landmark https://www.waze.com/editor/#?%23%3F=&z ... rks=797743 and now when you search you get LAX, Los Angeles, CA in the top two items of the search. So I know the search is using landmark information in the client and map editor... Creating the landmark may have not been in the best practices but I was able to get the search to work and it returns the correct location.


Great way to simplify :) However, all the terminals, taxi-ways, runways etc,,seem way too detailed. Is that really necessary? I know you didn't create them.....I just think all those extra nodes just take up unnecessary storage. Should all that be whittled down also?

Just thinking out loud :)
Area Manager: Pinellas, Pasco & Hillsborough Counties FL
Phone: Samsung GS 2, Sprint, Android 4.1.2
Waze: 3.7.2

Waze FAQ...Best Map Editing Practice...Correct Server?...User Manual
razor2k
 
Posts: 1392
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 8:40 pm
Location: Saint Petersburg, FL
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 54 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby razor2k » Mon May 27, 2013 4:58 am

jasonh300 wrote:One thing I'd like to mention is that I'd like to see the quick link to Parking Lots removed from the Landmarks pulldown in the editor. I really don't think Gas Stations needs to be there anymore after the import, but I guess that could be useful for countries where the gas stations have not yet been imported. They're both inviting people to use them improperly now.


I would like to see the whole landmarks dropdown revamped. Many options serve no purpose anymore.

It could be so much more simplified.

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2
Area Manager: Pinellas, Pasco & Hillsborough Counties FL
Phone: Samsung GS 2, Sprint, Android 4.1.2
Waze: 3.7.2

Waze FAQ...Best Map Editing Practice...Correct Server?...User Manual
razor2k
 
Posts: 1392
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 8:40 pm
Location: Saint Petersburg, FL
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 54 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby razor2k » Thu May 02, 2013 12:44 am

vectorspace wrote:I enter small bodies of water because they were never on the water layer in Waze and never showed up on the client. I think they are vital visual references to understand the map that is displayed on the client and should be entered. If you mark them as sea/lake/levee, then Waze can always choose to not display them.


I see your point to the visual reference thing, which would be fine if you just do a simple polygon of the object. However, I've seen detailed outlines of "retention ponds" which have probably upwards of 100 nodes. :o ....This is not good.
Area Manager: Pinellas, Pasco & Hillsborough Counties FL
Phone: Samsung GS 2, Sprint, Android 4.1.2
Waze: 3.7.2

Waze FAQ...Best Map Editing Practice...Correct Server?...User Manual
razor2k
 
Posts: 1392
Joined: Thu May 10, 2012 8:40 pm
Location: Saint Petersburg, FL
Has thanked: 62 times
Been thanked: 54 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby PhantomSoul » Fri Oct 25, 2013 5:51 pm

Two things:

1. I thought the CONST ZN suffix was only for segments totally disconnected from the road network during construction but expected to be reconnected at some point in the future. We do this instead of deleting them to avoid losing the road metric data they've collected, and the CONST ZN serves as note to anyone reviewing the map for disconnected segments as to why it's there and disconnected. So I'm not sure what the fuss about TTS trying to read CONST ZN is about.

2. As I understand it, there is no reliable predictability, at least within the context of WME, for which landmarks will appear, when, and for how long, or whether a particular landmark's name is displayed in any of the Waze clients. Rather they are rendered (or hidden) as a function of zoom level and other higher priority things drawn on the map around it, like other roads, their names, city names, the navigation line and its bubble names, etc. As such, denoting construction zones with landmarks does not really add any kind of reliable value to the Waze clients, but it does add extra noise to the landmarks database.

I would think that we should have a way to identify long-term construction zones in a broader sense than just temporarily re-configuring sections of roads. If fed to the Waze clients correctly, it could provider the driver with valuable information about constructions zones up ahead and maybe even a warning to keep an eye out since the map may be slightly outdated there. However, because of the way landmarks are rendered, I do not think that landmarks will adequately meet this objective.
ImageImageImageImageImage
Waze Editing Manual | USA Road Types | USA Forum
Verizon iPhone 6 / iOS (latest) / Waze (latest/beta)
PhantomSoul
Local Champ Mentor
Local Champ Mentor
 
Posts: 3404
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:00 am
Location: Union, NJ USA
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 521 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby PhantomSoul » Tue Jun 11, 2013 7:05 pm

So then why are we just not landmarking everything that can pretty much be traced from the aerials? In fact, it's probably where we're heading anyway, because if we keep on locking all the roads we edit in our wake - or if they are auto-locked by the system, it will leave little else for new editors to do except add landmark traces.
ImageImageImageImageImage
Waze Editing Manual | USA Road Types | USA Forum
Verizon iPhone 6 / iOS (latest) / Waze (latest/beta)
PhantomSoul
Local Champ Mentor
Local Champ Mentor
 
Posts: 3404
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:00 am
Location: Union, NJ USA
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 521 times

Re: Landmark - Best Practices US

Postby PhantomSoul » Tue Jun 11, 2013 4:06 pm

I think we're still very divided on whether POI's in general should be included as landmarks, since Waze does not provide any kind of interface in the WME for inputting and maintaining a native database of POIs and there's a lot of frustration with such POI's not appearing visually on the map.

We seem to just keep see-sawing back in forth where the yay-sayers add businesses they feel are navigationally significant, while the nay-sayers just go around deleting them and the yay-sayers then re-add them...

...lather, rinse, repeat ad nauseum.

Frankly, until we can get a better consensus on POIs, which is what businesses are - not landmarks, an official wiki will have limited effect because people are going to just do whatever they want while about half the community supports them and the other half tries to slam them.
ImageImageImageImageImage
Waze Editing Manual | USA Road Types | USA Forum
Verizon iPhone 6 / iOS (latest) / Waze (latest/beta)
PhantomSoul
Local Champ Mentor
Local Champ Mentor
 
Posts: 3404
Joined: Wed Oct 10, 2012 4:00 am
Location: Union, NJ USA
Has thanked: 313 times
Been thanked: 521 times

PreviousNext

Return to United States

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users