Mark Moving Police differently!

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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby wisedraco » Fri Aug 02, 2013 6:43 am

daknife wrote:
It says none of those things, it says "At least four minutes ago someone saw a police car at this very specific point of ground." That is it. That officer may have had someone pulled over, may be sitting on the side of the road watching for speeders and other violators (both valid reports) or, he may have been cruising watching for speeders, cruising trying to do a slowdown, may have been going on a call, may have been going to dinner, may have been going to work, may have been going home, but most importantly was at this spot at least four minutes ago and is now most likely miles away (or kilometers away). So by the time you get this report the officer could, have someone pulled over, still be driving but four minutes down the road, may be at a call, may be at dinner, may be at the station, may be home, but most importantly (if the officer was moving) IS NOT HERE any more. A police report does not block out a section of road that may be patrolled, it says an officer is at this geographic point at some fairly recent but still minutes ago period of time. There is no value to navigation, there is no value to a rapidly outdating report(every second the officer gets further away from the point and each intersection vastly increases the possibilities of where he could go.) And too many false reports result in drivers just ignoring them, including the legitimate ones resulting in getting caught speeding and more importantly in not knowing ahead of time to move over and slow down for safety reasons.


Yes, yes,yes, you right.
IS NOT HERE ANYMORE. but he's here there around and may catch you for speeding.
cannot see your point -for what reason, you think, police reports in waze is need?
for me, as i already says, is more important to not catch for speeding or so, than a "false alarm".
for me lot better is ten times slow down to legal speeds, than one time get catched for speeding, because in that situation i lost my money, time, and possible - licence. false warnings and driving in speed limits no introduce any lose for me, as so i always be winner there. but if anyone thinking not show moving police at all - there is big chances get a speed ticketing, who really put down whole thing about police reports in waze - because always there will be moving police, who can give you speeding tickets, in any place, and peoples like you say "moving police must not be showing, because it not there, but 200 metres further!".
for me, it looks very, very strange and alogically.
P.S. do you hear about Pascal's Wager?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager
i think, that situation, about we there discuss is very similar -if you report about moving police and all around see that and slow down - no one had loss. there is only a gains. for absolutely all, including driving safety, and police ( except amount of police collect money).
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby Daknife » Thu Aug 01, 2013 5:11 am

wisedraco wrote:on my experience, it rides in the district - in example, in via baltic it move around 10 - 20 kilometres, then turn around, drives again 10 - 20 kilometres, again turn around and so on. based on that, i can easily see a benefit from showing moving police. for example, when one wazers report on map "moving police", it also choose what direction that police drive, and then, waze get average driving speed on that lane, and warn all wazers in, say, 10 kilometres from that point to both direction about "in that stage is moving police car" ?
i think, it is a good thing...?


It says none of those things, it says "At least four minutes ago someone saw a police car at this very specific point of ground." That is it. That officer may have had someone pulled over, may be sitting on the side of the road watching for speeders and other violators (both valid reports) or, he may have been cruising watching for speeders, cruising trying to do a slowdown, may have been going on a call, may have been going to dinner, may have been going to work, may have been going home, but most importantly was at this spot at least four minutes ago and is now most likely miles away (or kilometers away). So by the time you get this report the officer could, have someone pulled over, still be driving but four minutes down the road, may be at a call, may be at dinner, may be at the station, may be home, but most importantly (if the officer was moving) IS NOT HERE any more. A police report does not block out a section of road that may be patrolled, it says an officer is at this geographic point at some fairly recent but still minutes ago period of time. There is no value to navigation, there is no value to a rapidly outdating report(every second the officer gets further away from the point and each intersection vastly increases the possibilities of where he could go.) And too many false reports result in drivers just ignoring them, including the legitimate ones resulting in getting caught speeding and more importantly in not knowing ahead of time to move over and slow down for safety reasons.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby wisedraco » Wed Jul 31, 2013 8:27 am

txemt wrote:If the cop is moving, it shouldn't be reported in the first place. A lot of people don't understand that. If you report a cop, you're putting down a point on a map and "advertising" something is there. If the cop is moving....it's not THERE!!! Ugh....

on my experience, it rides in the district - in example, in via baltic it move around 10 - 20 kilometres, then turn around, drives again 10 - 20 kilometres, again turn around and so on. based on that, i can easily see a benefit from showing moving police. for example, when one wazers report on map "moving police", it also choose what direction that police drive, and then, waze get average driving speed on that lane, and warn all wazers in, say, 10 kilometres from that point to both direction about "in that stage is moving police car" ?
i think, it is a good thing...?

P.S. yes,yes, i read whole topic. many of us want to break speed limit every yard, when it is possible. i think different - if you see a possibility of moving police -from all things, is better to drive with legal speed even for 10 - 20 - or 30 miles, than break speed limit and get caught by police, even not speaking about safety...
from that point, i clearly see, a report and showing moving police car in mildly large road stage is good thing, without doubt.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby LadyBuell » Tue Jul 30, 2013 4:04 pm

pittpanther wrote:If someone is reporting the same cop moving cop multiple times, clearly they are abusing a loophole to get more points.

If I'm in a construction zone that lasts for 2 miles, I "could" report that a dozen times... There are several of these loopholes that can be abused to gain points. Not sure if these can all be addressed...


You know what would be a good option? If we could mark the start and end of the construction zone. When you hit hazard>on road>construction instead of having the send button have a start button and then change to send. Hit send to end the construction zone.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby txemt » Thu May 16, 2013 8:11 pm

Police I've been reporting haven't been showing up after I place them, even after 4 minutes.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby AndyPoms » Thu May 16, 2013 1:39 am

davipt wrote:
AndyPoms wrote:
CBenson wrote:I agree that moving police should be reported differently. That way waze can know to ignore the report. The reporters get to remain under the illusion that reporting a moving police car has any value and the map won't get cluttered with useless reports.

We could also use the same logic for Speed Camera Vans - put a "Mobile Speed Camera" report button in and it doesn't add a camera to WME, but adds a Police/Hazard Report.


I'd rather see the report camera option moved inside the map problem, next to the pave road, so people don't ever have the temptation to report cameras where they don't exist.

I support moving all the Camera reporting into Map Issue over what I proposed above (I just didn't have time to type that in this morning). However, we haven't been able to get any traction on getting it moved, so anything is better that what we have now.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby Bombebomb » Wed May 15, 2013 2:19 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:
bombebomb wrote:Think of it like reporting a hazard in the south bound lane when you're in the north bound lane, sure it's not important to you, but it's important to someone in those other lanes.

Completely inaccurate analogy! Since when did a hazard or an accident move at 100kph down the road? A police report for a moving vehicle is useless within 60 seconds or less. There are just as many people, if not more, who have griped about police reports they've slowed down for which no longer exist. More often than not it was a moving vehicle marked and in 2 minutes they've made 6 turns and are a mile away. Utterly useless to report moving police.
The idea of the analogy was to show that it's not always the cars ahead of you (going in the same direction as you) that would be important, it would be the cars coming towards you. This was a rebuttal to Daknife mentioning you catching up with a police car going in the same direction being unlikely.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Wed May 15, 2013 1:47 pm

bombebomb wrote:Think of it like reporting a hazard in the south bound lane when you're in the north bound lane, sure it's not important to you, but it's important to someone in those other lanes.

Completely inaccurate analogy! Since when did a hazard or an accident move at 100kph down the road? A police report for a moving vehicle is useless within 60 seconds or less. There are just as many people, if not more, who have griped about police reports they've slowed down for which no longer exist. More often than not it was a moving vehicle marked and in 2 minutes they've made 6 turns and are a mile away. Utterly useless to report moving police.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby Bombebomb » Wed May 15, 2013 12:42 pm

daknife wrote:But you are forgetting one key point. Any report takes about 4 minutes to propagate across the network, so such a report is worthless. Do Not report moving police. By the time anyone else sees your report, the officer is likely miles away in who knows what direction, from the point of the report.

What if that officer doesn't like waze and notes the blue subaru with the cell phone mounted on it's dash, and the driver tapped the phone a couple times and then the officer's location popped up on his waze screen, is that couple taps on the device going to violate the state's no texting laws? It's not an easy fix, and it's not a logical addition. A moving officer inserts too many variables to be able to predict his location for more than a few seconds. Or do you propose allowing users to repeatedly post about the officer they are following thus increasing the amount of spam rather than decreasing it, and further distracting those drivers making such posts.

It sounds like a good idea but it is not. There is NO value in reporting a moving police car. You don't know if he's cruising to show a presence, moving to a site to set up a radar trap, heading back to the office, heading to eat, heading home etc. A moving police car is not a hazard to navigation. Further; avoiding tickets is NOT the primary reason for these reports, even if it is reported as a speed trap, the real reason is to warn of the hazard created by the officer sitting on the side of the road.

What good does reporting the lane do, when 2 seconds after you hit send, he changes lanes? Then twenty seconds later he's off at the next off ramp? Your report is now more worthless than the frequent posts as he bounces down the road from speeder to speeder where he is usually going to be sitting for 10-15 minutes at a time.

But again all of you posting what a great idea this is are ignoring the fact that the moment you hit send the report is sent, four minutes will pass before anyone else sees it, but even if waze manages to cut it down to 10 seconds, the instant you post it it's set on the map, and 2 seconds later the officer changes direction speed or lane and your post is worthless. If you are six miles away from an "in motion" police, unless he's just circling the same area you will most likely never see him, unless your overtake speed is so high that you deserve to get a ticket as you are a hazard to others.

Stationary police reports are often incorrect by the time they propagate across the network, and you somehow think moving reports would be an improvement?
I have seen multiple reports pop up in front of me, and even tested it with multiple cell phones I have never had a report more than two minutes from the first report. While some reports could take up to four minutes that is not something that occurs most of the time.

Waze has integrated voice reporting, if a particular person does not like voice reporting or does not work quite right for them. They can not report (since all of the reports they do would be illegal, police, accident, etc.) or continue breaking the law. The probability of a moving police officer seeing a wazer mess with his phone is substantially lower than a stationary police officer looking at each automobile which passes.

A moving officer does insert extra variables, however with a short 5-10 minute timer these variable are greatly reduced. If I see a moving report for police 6 minutes ago, I drive with in 3-4 miles of the marker and see no police I know he either hopped off an exit, pulled into the shoulder, or is sitting in the median. These possibilities can be narrowed down by knowing the area you drive.

Police are "never" off duty, if they are just patrolling making a presence and someone breaks the law, the officer will do the work he is required to do. Moving police can come at you, or be driving away from you. The police coming at you can clock your speed from the other side of the road. Think of it like reporting a hazard in the south bound lane when you're in the north bound lane, sure it's not important to you, but it's important to someone in those other lanes.
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Re: Mark Moving Police differently!

Postby dmcconachie » Wed May 15, 2013 11:46 am

davipt wrote:
AndyPoms wrote:
CBenson wrote:I agree that moving police should be reported differently. That way waze can know to ignore the report. The reporters get to remain under the illusion that reporting a moving police car has any value and the map won't get cluttered with useless reports.

We could also use the same logic for Speed Camera Vans - put a "Mobile Speed Camera" report button in and it doesn't add a camera to WME, but adds a Police/Hazard Report.


I'd rather see the report camera option moved inside the map problem, next to the pave road, so people don't ever have the temptation to report cameras where they don't exist.

+1
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