Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby xander271 » Thu May 23, 2013 7:33 pm

Having run into this problem myself before finding this thread; I initially relied on the wiki. As a result I merged the road and lost half the addresses.

I've edited the wiki before a re-write is done so someone else doesn't delete addresses like I did.
http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Area ... -Way_Roads.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Sat Jun 01, 2013 6:27 pm

I drove Al Wasl Road and Jumeira road yesterday and today. Whilst these roads are drawn on the map editor as two split-lanes, you can't see it on the phone application that way. Since the lanes are so close they just merge into one with maybe the occasional tiny gap. With auto-zoom enabled, there is no visible distinction between split and un-split roadways.
bazgrant wrote:The roads are physically split carriageways so should reflect that on all maps.

I'm of the opinion that it is better to have a structure that works for its intended function than to try and replicate every tiny detail which doesn't seem to serve a purpose.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Mon May 27, 2013 9:42 am

nomadica wrote:I did notice at 2 separate traffic signals, it was asking me to drive to the next junction, make a uturn and then take a right rather than just taking a left.

It seems that you too have found some roads with the same errors I referred to. Instead of going straight it would route right, and then a "turn left and then turn left" prompt to bring you to the other side of the intersection.

The same as you, I checked the turn restrictions at the intersection and everything is set correctly, but it will still route to the right.

That is why I feel that a simplified map is the way forward.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Mon May 27, 2013 6:02 am

Since I changed it, it now works correctly.
nomadica wrote:I'm curious, regarding the route to work, since then I assume you changed it to two way roads correct?

Did that solve the issue or did it still send you 13 km extra?

I'll try out navigating my normal routes this week and see how it works out
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Fri May 17, 2013 7:51 pm

The reason I started un-splitting some roads is because they weren't working. In the area around my work I would go somewhere and then set the route back to the office. On one route I was about 2km from the office but it provided me with a 15km route since it couldn't route via the intersections and would mostly only turn right.

I didn't initially un-spit the road, since I also read the same paragraph you quoted about leaving it as is. I tried fixing and repeatedly driving the route over a few weeks, but eventually decided on un-splitting the road; now it works fine.

I still very often, on well frequented roads, find directions where it will not route straight through the intersection, but use multiple right hand turns via the adjoining suburb just to bring me back to the other side of the signal. In many cases the destination would be on my left and I only need to turn left at the next signal, but would be presented with a loooooong loop to the right and then back again.

And I think if we must change certain areas, then we should work together to ensure that its done properly so we don't end up with unfinished work resulting in hundreds of problem reports

100% agree with this, and this is why I opened this thread. At the moment I only work on areas I can complete, and verify every turn restriction in one go. The really long roads I would like us to handle together.

PS: As I also mentioned in a previous post, you won't believe the number messy edit artefacts I found once again on two more roads: There were in places up to four unconnected road segments right on top of each other. As soon as I move the one segment out of the way I find that there are more segments underneath it.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Thu May 16, 2013 2:47 pm

As per the Wiki reagding Simplicity.
It is not a goal to model the physical roadway lane-by-lane. Doing so often leads to unnecessary complexity--which means a cluttered map, confusing verbal directions, and lots and lots (and lots!) of extra map maintenance.

When to Split a Two-Way Road (and when not to):
A road should not be split when:
  • There is a curb or non-drivable median less than 5m wide between lanes of travel (see exceptions above).
  • The non-drivable median is interrupted by a cross segment at most intersections.
  • There is a center turn lane (any width) between directions of travel. Splitting this type of road created problems when people turn from the middle lane because there is no road for the navigation to follow.
  • (Just because) Google Maps or other mapping source show it as a split road.

If you have seen the two roads I cleaned up last night, it would be better if there aren't all these small segments to work on. Both these roads had tiny segments which were so small that I had to stretch it out just to be able to select it for deletion. And then also, there were multiple unconnected segments on top of each other.

What the maps needs is a serious cleaning out before is will be usable. As it stands now it can't even give me a proper route to a location which is directly in front of me.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Wed May 15, 2013 1:57 pm

The benefit of using a single two-way road instead of two one-way roads is that you can properly control turn restrictions which becomes nearly impossible when you have four lines crossing.

Two examples I can think of right now with specific turn restrictions:
Hessa Street / First Al Khail Street intersection near Saudi German Hospital
When coming off Hessa street towards First Al Khail Street you can only turn left or right; you are not allowed to continue straight.

Al Waha Street, Al Quoz
For the entire run of Al Waha street you are not allowed to make U-turns, however for the roads it crosses U-turns are allowed on those roads.

Don't even try the spaghetti junctions I have seen - this does not work at all and the voice prompts are misleading.
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Wed May 15, 2013 1:47 pm

Here is a topic from the main forums un-splitting roads: https://world.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=48787

For the North American server, the u-turn function was added somewhere in 2011, for the World server (i.e. the rest of us) this function became available in April 2013 it seems.

The 3.6 Waze App can't support u-turns yet, but might be in the 3.7 version which is currently in test phase.
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Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby TheOtherNeo » Sun May 05, 2013 7:55 pm

I have been reading up on using split lanes versus single streets on the forums; it appears that using a two-way street is now the preferred way of creating roads. Split lanes should only be used for major highways and freeways. For us that would be the E-something (E-11, E-66, E-311 etc.) roads.

Two-way streets can be marked with a u-turn, and from the forums it seems that this functionality will be rolled out to the apps at a later stage in order to allow roads to receive updates first (U-turn Restrictions?). There are a quite a number of roads in Dubai marked as split-lanes which could benefit from being reduced to a two-way street with the proper turn restritions such as Jumeira Road.

Another note: for landmarks, it is suggested that the number of points should be kept to a minimum and not every detail needs to be drawn (Landmark Database Size Reduction).
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Re: Split Lanes vs Two-Way Roads

Postby nomadica » Thu May 23, 2013 2:42 pm

you replied before i edited the post :) i dont think you can manually enter a camera, only approve it. I've had some times when I tried to move one reported somewhere to where i know it is, and an error came saying that i've moved it more than permitted.

anyways, lets not mix topics because it will be harder to refer to later if needed.

have we concluded anything now about this project? I am quite convinced now that its best way to go. However, i'm seeing that its not going to be as clutter free as i thought it would. For example here an error is coming up even though right hand turn is enabled. We can either draw the road or mark as not identified, but then will the error come back? i saw this same thing happen somewhere else today also
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