To our Indonesian community:

Please consider reviewing this thread before addressing IMDashti's request:
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=310554

GFM_Danny wrote:same issue with the previous post

thanks

Hey Danny,

Have you tried requesting an AM area around the territorial waters of Indonesia so you can handle this? I had to do that with Canada because the Country Manager boundaries didn't cover things correctly.

GFM_Danny wrote:two suggestion about UR in the centercode, give UR a life time, so that old UR, out side everyone edit area cleaned by it self.

Unfortunately, as long as there are editors like IMDashti who are seeking URs just for the sake of closing them, that will be difficult to support. He has already shown himself to be going outside the boundaries and trying to get URs closed in self-managed regions that had their leadership saying to leave the URs alone.

IMDashti wrote: Correction: I intend to close URs that need to be closed, either by solving the problem, or closing them as "not identified" if the problem is so. I don't just close "URs for the sake of closing them", as you claim.

This is absolutely the definition of closing them for the sake of closing them. You're not a local editor contributing to the map in the area on a long-term basis. You're seeking out URs that are far outside your normal editing area, getting a postage-stamp-sized AM, dealing with the UR, then moving on.

This is the way I understand the objective of any UR: it is meant as a way for a Wazer to report a problem.

That is true. But the problem may be bigger than you understand, particularly in the case of ones that senior editors leave behind.

In a normal situation, there's no need to keep a UR beyond its intended purpose as a way for Wazers to communicate a map problem.

Says you. An editor with barely enough edits to warrant Rank 5, despite having been editing for 7 years.

What if a UR is kept for a reason beyond handling map problems? Well, this is not normal. If the reason is technical, then Waze has to be contacted to correct the technical issue. If the reason is sentimental, I don't think (at least personally) that it should be kept open. I understand that others may think differently about sentimental value of a UR, but this is not normal in an editor's professional work, or intended purpose of a UR.

That's not up to you, especially when we're not talking about your home community.

I've reached out to some of the senior editors and Champs in your home area. I will be discussing this further with them and encouraging them to apply some appropriate remedial communication with you as it's clear you have trouble respecting those in the GC community.

same issue with the previous post

thanks

doctorkb wrote:

GFM_Danny wrote:same issue with the previous post

thanks

Hey Danny,

Have you tried requesting an AM area around the territorial waters of Indonesia so you can handle this? I had to do that with Canada because the Country Manager boundaries didn't cover things correctly.

yes, we do have, during the Falcon Mapraid, all of us who participate got whole country area opened as AM, and I already closed some old UR or MP, edit some island which can't do with CM rights before.
but since the area is very big, we missed some old UR.
That is one reason why i wrote two suggestion about UR in the centercode, give UR a life time, so that old UR, out side everyone edit area cleaned by it self. and also limit the user to send UR. in Jakarta City for example, there are so many UR, and we editor are overwhelmed.
just for that one UR request an AM in middel of no where, imho, its not that nesscary. better is that hq can fix the boundaries issue.

Regards

doctorkb wrote:

GFM_Danny wrote:two suggestion about UR in the centercode, give UR a life time, so that old UR, out side everyone edit area cleaned by it self.

Unfortunately, as long as there are editors like IMDashti who are seeking URs just for the sake of closing them, that will be difficult to support. He has already shown himself to be going outside the boundaries and trying to get URs closed in self-managed regions that had their leadership saying to leave the URs alone.

in case the UR have no description or not any replay from the wazer who reported it, i will close the UR, and I also got a PM from IMdashti. but unfortunately, most UR that IMDashti sent are in the sea, which we can't do anything, even it is in our teritory.
that's the issue, if possible of course we will help.

UR lama nggak perlu perlu banget ditutup. nggak guna juga kalau ditutup. terkadang di beberapa meetup, UR lama yang masih muncul, dipakai buat penyemangat bahwa dulu dulu sekali, di sini sudah ada wazer. jadi masukan dari saya, kalau itu pun ditutup, kita nggak ada history record kalau di sini sudah ada wazer sejak dulu kala.

In a normal situation, there's no need to keep a UR beyond its intended purpose as a way for Wazers to communicate a map problem. What if a UR is kept for a reason beyond handling map problems? Well, this is not normal.

ini yang Anda ndak pahami dari komunitas disini. tolong sebelum Anda bicara, dipikir dulu, ditimbang dulu, dan dimengerti dulu. kalau perlu dipikir sambil ngopi biar fresh dalam berpikir. nggak perlu Anda memaksakan isi kepala Anda dengan kebijakan yang ada disini. Anda sudah level 5 harusnya sudah paham tentang ini.
Dimana bumi dipijak, disitu langit dijunjung.

demikian, mohon bisa dipahami, dimengerti, maklumi dan resapi itu. trims.

note : because this post in indonesian forum, i must write in indonesian. so other editor will know what i write and mean.

doctorkb wrote:

GFM_Danny wrote:two suggestion about UR in the centercode, give UR a life time, so that old UR, out side everyone edit area cleaned by it self.

Unfortunately, as long as there are editors like IMDashti who are seeking URs just for the sake of closing them, that will be difficult to support. He has already shown himself to be going outside the boundaries and trying to get URs closed in self-managed regions that had their leadership saying to leave the URs alone.

Correction: I intend to close URs that need to be closed, either by solving the problem, or closing them as "not identified" if the problem is so. I don't just close "URs for the sake of closing them", as you claim.

This is the way I understand the objective of any UR: it is meant as a way for a Wazer to report a problem.
- If the problem is showing, an editor has to solve the problem and then close the UR.
- If the problem is not obvious, the reporting Wazer has to be contacted to clarify the problem. If a clarification is received, the problem is solved and the UR is closed. If the clarification points to no particular problem, or no clarification is received, the UR is closed as "not identified".
- Even if the UR seems to be wrongly-reported (like most of ones in the middle of water), it is always recommended that the Wazer reporting should be contacted before closing the UR.

In a normal situation, there's no need to keep a UR beyond its intended purpose as a way for Wazers to communicate a map problem. What if a UR is kept for a reason beyond handling map problems? Well, this is not normal. If the reason is technical, then Waze has to be contacted to correct the technical issue. If the reason is sentimental, I don't think (at least personally) that it should be kept open. I understand that others may think differently about sentimental value of a UR, but this is not normal in an editor's professional work, or intended purpose of a UR.

I stress again that what I do is not intended "for the sake of closing [URs]", but to handle them appropriately. Links I gave in my post in the China forums (see viewtopic.php?f=368&t=301814) clearly show that I contributed in drawing many areas that were left unhandled for almost 8 years. Imagine. Some Wazer wants a map to be drawn since 8 years, and no one did that! When someone like me invests so much time to draw the blank areas (with thousands of segments added), someone comes to claim that I intend to close URs just "for the sake of closing them".

It was said that such task has to be left for local editors, and that my actions (as an outsider) are intrusive. Really? Are you serious? Solving a UR that could not be handled by local editors for 8 years is intrusive? Come on. Being an AM for sparse places and "various places in between" is okay, but helping places that are left without help for 8 years is intrusive?! This is like saying to a doctor: "Don't go to help the sick in some remote place of the world, because it is the job of local doctors, even when there are no local doctors".

I wish local editors would jump in to handle their own areas, but that is no reason for not assisting Wazers in drawing maps where no local editors are available. Personally, I helped in solving so many problems in Iran, Iraq and Saudi Arabia until local editors started to show up and help in taking care of problems in their own countries. I continue to contact them from time to time to help in resolving more and more problems. I even did extra work in promoting Waze in their countries. One key to promoting Waze: make the map useful. If the map is kept blank or wrong (as with the case with those 8-year-old URs), any new Wazer would find Waze useless. By drawing the needed maps (even in other parts of the world), we would encourage the use of Waze, and eventually local editors will show up to refine or continue the job we started. This is one of the purposes of such actions as MapRaids.

As I always say: "The work will go on..."