[New Template] State Template suite

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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Aug 04, 2014 6:24 am

Fredo-p wrote:
sketch wrote:I think only sysops can delete pages. I suppose it would be wise to move, like, Michigan/test to Michigan/Delete/Test, Michigan/Resources to Michigan/Delete/Resources, etc., to mark them for deletion. Then, create Michigan/Test and start there.

It should be fine to just start over at Michigan/Test without deleting anything, but that'd make it harder to track down and find the unneeded pages leftover from the first time.


I thought pages that needed deletion get tagged with {{ToDelete}} as per the wiki:https://wiki.waze.com/wiki/Template:ToDelete

Place {{ToDelete}} on pages that should not have been added or now need to be deleted and a Wiki administrator can come through and delete the page completely.

I have the delete option with my account. The ToDelete template can be used as well as just sending me a PM.

I would recommend starting over with Michigan/Test. I can always find the other subpages and delete them since they are all related.

I will also look into why the lower case did not work for future reference. The templates should have automatically accepted it, but maybe one of the functions forces a cap on the subpage name that I did not notice in my testing.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby SkiDooGuy » Mon Aug 04, 2014 6:34 am

Thank you, I have created the new page and am working through updating it.

I have also correctly marked the erroneous page for deletion.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby Fredo-p » Mon Aug 04, 2014 6:36 am

It must have been a fluke for this one time as I never had this issue nor has anyone else reported something like this, as far as I know.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby qwaletee » Mon Aug 04, 2014 12:21 pm

kentsmith9 wrote:Good questions. Let me address each.
...
qwaletee wrote:The CM/RC/AM/SM sections, when you edit them using the template (as linked form the doc page) tell you to go back and click the link next to the table. I don't think that's the correct instruction. It appears to be fixed boilerplate, so better get that straightened out before any real pages go live. Hopefully, I've just misunderstood it, but even so, that's cause for a bit of alarm.

I am not sure I follow what you might be seeing as broken. Maybe give me a link to a specific page that you believe is incorrect. Currently the states being tested are all working for editors based on the instructions the are reading. I believe they are currently correct.
...


Go to Hawaii test discussion https://wiki.waze.com/wiki/Talk:Hawaii/Test
Click the Area managers - "Click to Edit" link
http://wiki.waze.com/wiki/index.php?tit ... ers/Main*/

The following boilerplate displays as wiki source:
Code: Select all
---- Area Managers: Cancel edit and use link on table next to "Area Managers". -----
---- Other Area Editors: Cancel edit and use link on table next to "Other Area
----     Editors". If does not exist, that section can be added from talk page.---- Country/State Managers: Continue.

In the volunteers table, there are links in each section, so for example, in the area managers section, there's a link - "Add to or edit this section"
https://wiki.waze.com/wiki/index.php?ti ... pdate*/%20

When you click that link, you get to the real edit UI for that section. So there's a disconnect between the discussion page edit instruction and the correct link for editing a portion of the overall volunteers table.

Either the discussion page needs a full set of links, one to each table section, or a single link to a separate instructional page, which I don't know how it would work. But the above setup doesn't make sense -- go to discussion, click the link that you've asked the user to click, to get to a page telling the user that it is the wrong thing, and then the user has to manually navigate back to find what you are talking about, and figure out to click a link in the table (which is not described well, "link on table next to 'Area Managers'" can be a little confusing, especially with the multiple links, and the cognitive separation due to the navigation steps).

For example, one way to handle this would be, instead of displaying the existing link in the discussion page, there could be a bit of text, "Click the link below to go to the list of volunteers. You can then look at for the correct section of the table (Area Managers, Other editors, etc.), and click the "Edit this portion of the table" link [[....|Click here to go to the volunteers list]]. That would be a link to the READ version of the page, anchor link for the table. Since this is the one section where editing is essentially meant to be done from links on the main page, not the discussion page, it would be workable, if a little awkward. But at least there'd be no surprises, or manual navigation. On the downside, it would make the table of links on the discussion page less pretty.

Also, in all those SCROLL DOWN FOR INSTRUCTIONS boilerplates, can I suggest the actual instructions have more presence by starting with the following (first four lines are new in this example):

Code: Select all
=====================================================================================
=======                                                 =============================
=======    INSTRUCTIONS     -     START READING HERE    =============================
=======                                                 =============================
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
-- Editors: To add yourself to this Area Manager table, copy and paste the following
-- template into the space below with the other {{AM/Editor|...}} templates. Add
-- yourself into rank order (higher at top)then alphabetical order by user name (A-Z)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


If you like, I can help you work on any of the above to true it up to a UI as described.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:43 pm

qualetee, more good questions.

The links you provided are separate links on purpose. The original goal of the Area Manager table was to simplify the editing process for the Area Managers by what is assumed less experienced Wiki editors. The table itself was always going to be the source of the edit links.

If you look at the content, there are two different sets of template code. The code linked from the Talk page goes to the entire table where State and Country managers add themselves. That section includes all the code for the whole table (excluding the Area Manager subsection). That is also the same link you see on the table itself from the main page.

The Rank 3-4 Area Manager section is only accessed (currently) from the Area Manager table under the heading "Area Managers". That link only shows the portion of the table specific to the bottom with "Area Managers".

These two different sections was done because of feedback from the team that the entire table was too confusing to new editors.

Since I now have links from both the talk page and Area Manager table, I can see the potential confusion that the Area Manager only subsection is not also linked from the Talk page. I can add another entry on the talk page and also clarify that the links are going to different parts of the table.

I can also update the instructions to the "Start reading here" to be more clear as you have outlined.

Let me know if you think the things I mentioned will address your concerns.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby qwaletee » Mon Aug 04, 2014 3:51 pm

Kent,

I think so, yes, it is addressing the questions. Is there any reason why the talk page cannot have separate links to the different sections of the table? The code that links from the internal sections of the table may not be compatible as-is (because it expects to be run from the state page, not the talk page), but it shouldn't be hard to adapt them. You're already using page property parsing.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:09 pm

qwaletee wrote:Is there any reason why the talk page cannot have separate links to the different sections of the table? The code that links from the internal sections of the table may not be compatible as-is (because it expects to be run from the state page, not the talk page), but it shouldn't be hard to adapt them. You're already using page property parsing.

Absolutely. I was proposing that above, but I guess I was not very clear. :D
kentsmith9 wrote:I can add another entry on the talk page and also clarify that the [original and new] links [on the talk page table] are going to different parts of the [area manager] table.


It will take a little more programming because that section of the talk page table will need to be dynamic to whether the table was already created or not before you can edit the AM subsection, but I have code like that elsewhere, so not too hard to achieve. I just need to have a clear head to ensure the static pages, preloads and final pages all work correctly. ;)

I can likely get that in the next few days. In the mean time, I threw in a quick footnote for editors who edit the table before I make that update to the talk page.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby qwaletee » Mon Aug 04, 2014 4:31 pm

Lua :)
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby pumrum » Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:03 pm

I also think the area managers table should be tweaked to emphasize those who are dedicated to a specific state, so that you have clearly defined, in the following order:

1) The Regional Coordinator(s)
2) The State Manager(s)
3) Other editors, including CMs, in order of rank

Since there are often many Rank 5 and 6 editors in a state that are not acting as the State Manager and are not Country Managers, this would prevent the RC and SM role from getting "lost in the fray" and also prevent the CMs who work in the area from being inundated with tasks that the SM should be handling. I can mock up the CT page with what I think might look good if you'd like.
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Re: [New Template] State Template suite

Postby Fredo-p » Mon Aug 04, 2014 7:23 pm

pumrum wrote:I also think the area managers table should be tweaked to emphasize those who are dedicated to a specific state, so that you have clearly defined, in the following order:

1) The Regional Coordinator(s)
2) The State Manager(s)
3) Other editors, including CMs, in order of rank

Since there are often many Rank 5 and 6 editors in a state that are not acting as the State Manager and are not Country Managers, this would prevent the RC and SM role from getting "lost in the fray" and also prevent the CMs who work in the area from being inundated with tasks that the SM should be handling. I can mock up the CT page with what I think might look good if you'd like.

Take a look at my AZ as I have already had it set that way since the beginning

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