[page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

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[page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby johnsninja58 » Sun Aug 14, 2016 4:56 pm

As we know waze has released a new feature with parking lots and updated functionality in the editor related to this feature is being rolled out. The USA wiki page has been released to the masses and will probably be updated multiple times as this feature and information evolves.

I am assuming that there has been forum work on this topic but have my seen it in the normal channels or public sections and would like to start an area that can be used for this feature discussion. Also as previously discussed it would be ideal to have any wiki page have a link to a section of the forum to see evolving discussions on the topic. (Of course there always the transition to wazeopedia)

Anyways to start the discussion off on this section I have two questions about current guidance:

-Currently we are not being recommended from adding further PLA till they don't clutter the map in areas that they maybe masked by other areas is it acceptable to add? Or should guidance suggest discussion with your state managers about adding. I am aware of some parking lots that should be added but would like further guidance

-For places there is the option of adding "Parking for customers". Is this selection going to be associated with this new feature. Should editors be using adding feature? And should an area that has an associated parking lot like a mall area have the stores inside have this selected?
Last edited by johnsninja58 on Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby KTCAOP » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:00 pm

As far as I am aware - the "Parking for Customers" is not associated with the new feature.

I don't understand the following comment - "And should an area that has an associated parking lot like a mall area have the stores inside have this selected?" - when we map out the parking lots, we are mapping only the parking lots.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby johnsninja58 » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:08 pm

Here an example of an area that encompasses a parking lot but nothing is currently selected as parking for customer or mapped for parking lots
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby KTCAOP » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:32 pm

If I am seeing it correctly - there are no services selected at all - no website / phone number / etc. - I would consider this place as not complete.

If you currently search for L. L. Bean, however - it still shows you the "nearest parking lot" is at the "Hilton Garden Inn" - which is a bit unfortunate. We will want to map a parking lot area in only the parking lot to have it give better parking lot direction.

Again, for the parking lot areas to come, they would only be mapped to the parking lot.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby johnsninja58 » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:37 pm

Correct the place needs completion, but also current guidelines say not to add more parking lot areas. Hence my first question, using it as an example to spur guidance discussion.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby PesachZ » Sun Aug 14, 2016 5:49 pm

Hi there, until this feature reaches production WME I was not planning on making an official announcement.
You are correct considering the planning of this feature was confidential, and then beta only, any discussion on the wiki was also kept out of public channels, and therefore there was no topic to link to yet for this page. Now that you have started this topic we can link to it.
To answer your questions, there are several reasons we are holding off creating new PLAs for now until the rollouts are completed, so even in your example I'd follow the general rule of not creating any new PLAs until the feature is finished rolling out to the client and production WME, and the guidance is updated.
As far as the parking for customers service item, that should be checked on any place which offers parking for its customers, not just regular street parking or a public lot/garage nearby. AFAIK for now that box has nothing to do with this feature, and is a separate entity. It should still be filled accurately when possible, but will not affect the performance of this feature.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby D39Andrew » Sun Sep 25, 2016 1:03 am

Hi all,
I have been reading the Parking wiki https://wazeopedia.waze.com/wiki/USA/Places/Parking_lot and had a discussion item, which sent me here. I would like to discuss expanding and clarifying on the "Scope" and "What does not qualify as a PLA?" sections.

I am seeing a lot of new Parking lot areas added by new editors and that makes me ponder each of their edits. Do I reject their edit? Do I keep it? Does it need to be edited/changed? Being in an mature urban waze area, there are not a lot of things for a L1 editor to do, except add PL roads, and PL areas, and Place Points, etc. and they do so... (yes I try to contact them, but most do not have messaging set up).

Here are my points for discussion:
- Strip mall parking lot. Does it even need a PL Area? If that is your destination, then parking is right there. (including big box stores, grocery store shopping centers, etc.)
- Restaurant Parking lots - again, if your destination is the restaurant, then most likely, the parking lot is right there.

I agree that it may be good to have parking lot areas for large shopping malls, universities, stadiums, fairgrounds, etc. I do not believe they are needed for commercial office parks, or private enterprises (unless there is a need to show "visitor parking").

And what about in the downtown areas? This is where the PL areas will be most beneficial (as opposed to suburban areas). There are Public parking lots/facilities/areas, which I think should be marked. What about the many private parking lots for the workers in buildings? Those should probably not be marked. Or if waze insists, marked private parking, and not displayed on the live map.

Anyway, I know there's a lot of points I made, I just want to get a discussion going. In summary, I think that PL areas should focus on public parking venues in downtown areas. Additionally, in suburban and rural areas, only at venues such as large shopping centers (regional malls), universities/colleges, stadiums, fairgrounds or other event places. PL areas should not be for offices, restaurants, medium and small shopping centers (like big box stores, grocery stores, strip malls,etc.).
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby PesachZ » Sun Sep 25, 2016 1:19 am

The short answer is, we do want the parking lot areas even in the strip malls and the restaurants and the big box stores. The app will recommend a parking lot for you to go to, and it will seem very strange to a user to be recommended a lot further away and not the one right in front of the store because someone decided not to add that area attached to the store. That's said we are not adding lots of areas yet as you can see in the notice at the top of the page. For now the result of our discussions and communication with staff is there any parking lot is fair game however street parking would not be added you can see the examples listed for what not to add in the wiki.
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby D39Andrew » Sun Sep 25, 2016 3:39 am

Thanks for your insight PesachZ . I'm still not seeing the big picture. If I drive to my local Grocery Store/Big Box/whatever (in a strip mall with a large parking lot), why would I need a parking lot recommendation? In most cases (anything built in the suburban US in the last 40+ years or so), the parking lot is the 10 acres of blacktop right in front of the store. If I'm the shopping center owner, I don't want non-customers parking in the shopping center lot. Aren't PP and PLR's and the "WME Closest Segment" guiding one to the correct place?

When I think about urban US, and European cities, this PL area makes more sense. If I'm in (suburban) London, and have to pop over to my local Sainsbury which has the parking lot underneath it, then it makes sense. If I'm going to a shop on the High Street, knowing where to park would be good. Makes sense there.

Maybe suburban US is more of a special case than the other ~90% of the world.

When I think about it, it seems that the developers are planning that the driver's destination is now going to be the parking lot instead of the PP, which makes sense for the car (and Waze is a driving app for cars). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Re: [page discussion]Parking Lots Areas

Postby PesachZ » Sun Sep 25, 2016 6:37 am

D39Andrew wrote:Thanks for your insight PesachZ . I'm still not seeing the big picture. If I drive to my local Grocery Store/Big Box/whatever (in a strip mall with a large parking lot), why would I need a parking lot recommendation? In most cases (anything built in the suburban US in the last 40+ years or so), the parking lot is the 10 acres of blacktop right in front of the store. If I'm the shopping center owner, I don't want non-customers parking in the shopping center lot. Aren't PP and PLR's and the "WME Closest Segment" guiding one to the correct place?

When I think about urban US, and European cities, this PL area makes more sense. If I'm in (suburban) London, and have to pop over to my local Sainsbury which has the parking lot underneath it, then it makes sense. If I'm going to a shop on the High Street, knowing where to park would be good. Makes sense there.

Maybe suburban US is more of a special case than the other ~90% of the world.

When I think about it, it seems that the developers are planning that the driver's destination is now going to be the parking lot instead of the PP, which makes sense for the car (and Waze is a driving app for cars). ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

The way the app now works is such that any time you navigate to (or search) a destination (place), it will offer you parking lot choices which you may choose, or simply navigate to the point. If you area say dropping someone off you'd want to navigate straight to the spot, but if you needed to park you'd choose a lot presumably. This will happen regardless of if the destination is a standalone big-box store, in a small strip mall, or a large shopping center. The app will behave the same and offer each a parking suggestion. It will recommend one lot and then be able to list others nearby.
For the feature to work it needs to know where all the lots are. If the restaurant I'm going to has its own lot in the back, i want that recommended to me so I don't instead choose the municipal lot nearby. Knowing that restaurant had its own lot the app would recommend it or at least offer it as an option I could choose.

There is a lot more detail to how the recommendations work, but for them to work as planned the servers need to know all the options.

Of course if a lot is private for customers only, etc, it should be marked as such following the guidance in the wiki.

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That said we are still not yet creating new lot areas en-masse until the features are fully rolled out, namely to hide the polygons from the map in the client, and also to prevent having to come back and update them all when the rest of the planned features become available in WME. PLAs which already are on the map (from Waze imports) should not be deleted unless they meet criteria for PLAs not to map as listed in this wiki page, and with SM+ consultation.
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