[Page Update] House Numbers in WME

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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Mon Dec 17, 2018 5:33 pm

The Waze interpolation is very weak. Any forced HN (other than within the lightened distance from the segment) on a segment breaks the interpolation. Having one or none HN on a segment's side means there is no interpolation on that segment for that side. Having variable distances between numbers means the interpolation is off; it is basically figuring out equal spacing between existing numbers.
The combination of RPPs and HNs has been bantered about for years so is coming and having an RPP and a HN for the same address will mean we either have to address each individually or very well will get the wrong one merged between the two systems. So to me there is a higher cost to have the extraneous data than benefit from possible interpolation.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:18 am

I will go with the consensus of the community.

It appears that you have four options:
1) Leave a HN when a RPP is used
2) Delete the HN when a RPP is used
3) Let the Regions determine how they want to handle, similar to lock levels for segments
4) Be like the current wazeopedia page and be mute on the issue.



Leaving some HNs will actually break the interpolation/extrapolation.
Ex. 255 and 253 Leonard St, Abingdon, VA
The access to these two residences is between 249 and 245 Leonard St.
Here is a snapshot in WME
[ img ]
Here is a snapshot of the County GIS
[ img ]


If you leave the HNs where do you leave them? At the access to the driveway to 255 an 253? If so they make it so that the 249 is forced and interpolation is broken.
If you put them perpendicular from the road then 253 will be forced and breaks interpolation to the east.
There are some empty lots between 249 and 313 but there is a T interstection between them so no interpolation will occur since there are not two Waze HNs on a segment.


Abingdon is a great place where apparently drunk city planners came up with the address numbering system. There are several examples of the following.

625 Locust St is out of order
[ img ]
by using a RPP everyone gets proper routing and the lot 17-3-83 (between 651 and 663 Locust) will get interpolation whenever it is built and has a number assigned. Leaving the HN for 625 will break the interpolation because the HN will have to be forced.

So if you propose to leave the HNs, I would think that a more complicated explanation of when to keep and when to delete is required in the proposed page.

Or the ever popular way of having a lot of numbered residences on a parking lot road or private drive like Popular St (again in Abingdon)
[ img ]
Is it worth having all the HNs anchored to the named segment since you need the PLR so that the easternmost residences don't just snap to the Old Russell Rd?

Simplicity is a core principle of Waze editing. So removing the HN is easy and simple to remember and makes it so you don't have to address issues like the above.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Tue Dec 18, 2018 1:22 pm

I can live with Kartografer's proposed change, but it is a lot more complicated than saying if you use a RPP then remove the HN.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Thu Dec 27, 2018 11:00 pm

somewhere along the line the directions how to make a RPP (needing city and pin and nearby segment named with the exact street/city name match) was removed from what had been discussed months ago so I readded it. RPP Section.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:04 pm

It was not there last night, but today is is. PHSanders is Waze's pseudonym for me when they did a conversion to the wiki. I have removed the second redundant location of RPPs.

I will be proposing some modification to the Places page in that forum.
1) adding in the part about the <50 m for new RPP if there was a HN anchor
2) adding a brief RPP section to the part above the table of contents for the Places page to be consistent with area places and point places.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Sat Dec 29, 2018 5:21 pm

Sure, I was just listing the changes to the Places page here since somewhat related. Having a cross reference is fine that way only have to update one when something changes.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Mon Dec 31, 2018 5:18 pm

I was thinking more of having a link from one page to the other, just so it only has to be updated in one location if (or when) it changes.


In the guidance here in the House Numbers in WME section, I think think the statement that "additionally ensure the RPP's city name is listed a primary or alternate city name on a nearby segment." needs some clarification. The street and city name have to be paired as a primary (or alternate) selection - be an exact match. For the address on First St, Anytown, you can't just have First St , CensusDesigatedPlace with Maple Rd, Anytown nearby. You actually need First St, Anytown.

So I would change it to "additionally ensure the RPP's street name and city name are listed the primary or an alternate pairing on a nearby segment."

This occurs twice. Once in If an address is on an unnamed road segment and once in If the correct stop point for a house/business is on another road segment (differently named segment) away from its properly labeled segment in Waze
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Tue Jan 15, 2019 12:16 pm

kndcajun wrote:Hi folks. Thanks for the informative discussion about HNs. I have a question about HN interpolation.

First, thank you for the pyramid diagram on address searching priorities. Very helpful from an editor troubleshooting URs!

Now, let me say that I wish Waze HN interpolation would override google's. That's because as editors we have control over it. But I know that's another story...

My post here is regarding a behavior of Waze HN interpolation that is actually different from what is documented on WO. I have a case here where there is no Google addressing (so Waze HNs are the only data source), and Waze interpolation is working quite well - and EVEN over neighboring segments. When I read the wiki (WO), it implies that it won't work for even numbers on a segment unless two even numbers are already mapped on same segment, and generally on opposite sides of the point in question. But in my case, it is interpolating correctly when I have only one even at the far end of one segment, and one even at the opposite far end of a neighboring segment.

<https://www.waze.com/editor/?env=usa&lon=-90.45203&lat=30.46320&s=121091347&zoom=5&segments=509786187>

706 and 754 are mapped (on consecutive segments). Try searching for 726, 736, 746, etc. It works!

Am I misinterpreting?

Thanks for your insights!

Waze can always change programming, but the interpolation and extrapolation was a direct answer to a question that I brought up at a Regional Meetup in 2017. Nzahn1 drafted the posting and had it verified by staff.
Searches are made to be fuzzy, but have you used the Debug mode to see if the search thinks it is Waze or Google as the source?
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby subs5 » Sun Nov 10, 2019 5:09 am

dfortney wrote:We have an inconsistency regarding use of letters in the wiki article:

We have this statement:
"House numbers can contain numbers and letters, but cannot start with a letter."

and then later on, under House numbers vs. residential point places:

"House numbers cannot contain letters; RPPs can contain letters."

The second statement is incorrect - I propose we strike it.



Since the RPP having letters is recent, should the statement be: RPPs could not include letters until Oct 2019; there for some older ones may need to be updated to include the full address.

This way people know why it was just numerals.
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Re: [Page Update] House Numbers in WME

Postby voludu2 » Wed Nov 06, 2019 6:25 pm

That's a recent change. That statement should be updated.

Of course, I don't think Waze address search has been updated to work properly with Waze HNs (segment or RPP) that contain letters.
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