Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PleaseDriveFast » Mon Nov 30, 2015 10:11 pm

qwaletee wrote:Is there a public version of that form?


It's linked from the city smudge wiki. I think it's good to add guidance around the usage of this.

I'll also be looking to get another draft updated early this week. Q, you're consideration of when 2 similarly named roads exist in different municipalities of the same name is real, and needs to have called out. This most recently occurred with Lebanon Borough and Lebanon Township.
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby qwaletee » Wed Dec 02, 2015 1:40 am

I leave it in your able hands :)
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PhantomSoul » Mon May 22, 2017 10:32 am

The naming strategy information here is a little outdated. When we have overlapping municipality names with overlapping addresses and street names on different roads, we need to check if one is part of a CDP that is being used instead.

If you still have a conflict after that, you might want to consider what the post office does, since they require unique addresses per "postal city." Also, in most suburban neighborhoods, people are most likely to identify their mailing address as their navigational address as well.
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PleaseDriveFast » Mon May 22, 2017 4:35 pm

Right so given our lastest stance, I've gone ahead and drafted my proposal. I want to be sure to include how postal city names should be included since they can help serve a Waze result instead of Google.

Also, in checking both PA and NY, PA always uses a CDP in the primary city field. I think we can give the flexibility to allow for either incorporated name or CDP with CDP being preferred if it also serves as a postal name or for overlapping naming conflict.

Thoughts: https://wazeopedia.waze.com/wiki/USA/in ... st/sandbox?
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby qwaletee » Tue May 23, 2017 8:43 pm

I still have issues with CDP since they are arbitrary tracts designed for census taking and often do not reflect local community boundaries. I'd like to leave it as "differentiator of last resort," or to bolster a postal name above an incorporated name.

My order of preference:

1) (rare) Local name when universally used and well-researched
2) (rare) Postal name where it is corroborated by local usage or CDP, but only so long as both have similar boundaries
3) Incorporated name (unless it creates ambiguity or has a very strong, well-researched local objection)
4) Postal name, uncorroborated
5) CDP name
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PleaseDriveFast » Wed May 24, 2017 3:43 pm

qwaletee wrote:My order of preference:

1) (rare) Local name when universally used and well-researched
2) (rare) Postal name where it is corroborated by local usage or CDP, but only so long as both have similar boundaries
3) Incorporated name (unless it creates ambiguity or has a very strong, well-researched local objection)
4) Postal name, uncorroborated
5) CDP name


Would this preference apply to the Primary City Naming? Are you ok with adding postal addresses and incorporated municipal names to the alternative city field if they are not used for the primary?

As for #2, I don't think this would be rare but more uncommon. We can then use the following list provided by NJ.gov to validate the postal name against the CDP (http://www.state.nj.us/infobank/njzips.htm#7). For examples North Branch is a CDP of Branchburg and has a postal substation for the Somerville Zip Code 08876 which closely aligns to its CDP border.

I like this as it gives more direction on when a CDP is appropriate and prioritizes city names that are most likely to be searched in Waze.
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby qwaletee » Wed May 24, 2017 4:18 pm

I'm OK with adding secondaries, but let's watch out for any naming conflicts that may create. I'm sure there's some some town with no dedicated post office where the town name matches a post office elsewhere in the state.

For secondary names, we should only encourage it where there is genuine usage of the alternate name, or common confusion, e.g., at boundaries. I wouldn't smack down an editor who gets overzealous, though. These are the sort of arcane rules that are difficult to make sharp and ready.
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PhantomSoul » Thu May 25, 2017 4:17 pm

I understand those issues but I also feel that the situation with CDPs is not different enough from New York or Pennsylvania for all 3 states to not be doing the same thing. I also think we're missing the point by focusing too much on the polygon created instead of names displayed. I don't think it says anywhere in Waze specifications that primary city polygons must be municipal polygons; that's just an assumption we made, maybe even just asa single state in a vacuum.

In PA's current policy, CDP names strictly supersede municipal names (no leadership conversation required) where defined. In NY, non-municipal names are discussed and may be allowed, based on whether the area is better known by that name vs. its municipal name (and not by how it's boundaries compare to alternatives). Remember, polygons don't display on the app or livemap, and they can only impact routing if their shapes are very, very irregular. Do we know of any such well-known names of areas, or even any such CDPs?

I would go as far to say that most - as in a vast majority of - CDP areas are far better known by their CDP name than their municipal name, especially if many of its postal address city names agree with the CDP name.

Im ok with either PA or NY approach, frankly. I also think that adopting one or the other will enable us to better pressure the 3rd to subscribe to it as well. But considering how often non-incorporated names are better-known than incorporated ones, I very strongly feel that, as long as only PCNs get displayed, a municipal-only policy for PCNs just plain puts incorrect, or at least sub-accurate information on the app and livemap.
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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby voludu2 » Thu May 25, 2017 7:47 pm

qwaletee wrote:2) (rare) Postal name where it is corroborated by local usage or CDP, but only so long as both have similar boundaries

Color emphasis mine.

There is an inconsistency in this rule.
If the postal name is corroborated by local usage, but not by CDP, then there is nothing for the postal name area to have similar boundaries with. Postal names will almost always be corroborated by local usage, because people will be familiar with the their own mailing addresses and the mailing addresses of businesses, so this is not a rare situation.

Two Examples in SE PA. Is there anything like this in NJ?

Wayne, PA -- a postal name that overlaps portions of 3 different townships in 3 different counties, but is not associated with any municipality or CDP. But everyone locally knows where Wayne is. It's the whole area with a Wayne mailing address. Or at least the slightly higher-density area near the main line and the Wayne Hotel. It's a dot on the AAA map, but not an area with a defined boundary, unless you count the extent defined by the USPS Wayne postal routes.

Glen Mills, PA -- a postal name that matches no CDP or municipality, which overlaps 7 municipalities in 2 different counties. I've removed it from the map a couple of times. Boundary definition has a similar issue to Wayne. And the Glen Mills themselves were torn down long ago.
Last edited by voludu2 on Tue Nov 13, 2018 10:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Standards for Naming Townships in NJ

Postby PhantomSoul » Thu May 25, 2017 11:45 pm

Voludu, first - great to see you again. Second, the well-known name that is neither municipal nor CDP is much less common though it does happen in NJ and in NY. Parlin, NJ and Mountain Dale, NY both come to mind.
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