Get a sneak peek at whats next for Permanent Hazards on our April 7th Office Hours!

Post Reply

[Update] Road Closures

Post by Fredo-p
This page will need to be updated to reflect the new closures Doc that is being used. I am not aware of the exact details so someone with the knowledge will need to place this information in the correct location.

Road Closures
Fredo-p
Posts: 2008
Has thanked: 240 times
Been thanked: 522 times

POSTER_ID:16781248

1

Send a message

Arizona Wiki | @Waze_Arizona Twitter
Verizon Samsung Galaxy S8+

Post by DwarfLord
This is wonderful, thanks!

I do remain deeply concerned that the article implies that real-time restrictions fully close the affected segment, which appears not to be true. The best illustration might be this:

Consider a single segment that has a one-way closure put into effect. It is open to traffic westbound, but closed to traffic eastbound. The road crew has put a big "ROAD CLOSED" barrier at the west end of the segment.

The average editor could, I think, be forgiven for expecting that the result of a one-way real-time "closure" in WME will be that Waze will route drivers to destinations along that road by taking them to the east end and then into the segment westbound. But this is not what will happen. Waze will happily route drivers to the west end and right through the barrier.

To create the closure effect we want, it will be necessary either to close an additional segment leading into the west end which in many circumstances might require adding a junction node specifically to support this "lead-in" segment, or to add timed turn restrictions at the west end. But both of these approaches contradict the guidance in the wiki that there is no need to modify the map!

I may be misunderstanding the behavior of real-time restriction functionality, in which case I apologize! But this is how my tests are shaping up. If this is how real-time restrictions operate I believe it would be a great asset to editors for the wiki to articulate that.
DwarfLord
Wiki Master
Wiki Master
Posts: 2512
Has thanked: 1065 times
Been thanked: 1451 times
Send a message

Post by DwarfLord
While you're talking with the devs, here is a specific example of the problematic behavior. It is a vehicle-based restriction, not a real-time closure, but the behavior is identical.

https://www.waze.com/editor/?env=usa&lo ... ts=5071831

Only Muni buses may drive this segment eastbound. So, it was thought that a segment restriction that prohibited all but public transportation from eastbound travel would reflect that. But no!

We have a UR from a Wazer whose destination was on that segment whom Waze blithely routed right down the muni lane.

So, a one-way segment restriction actually treats the segment as two-way in the case of local traffic. I don't think that is intuitive behavior for segment restrictions any more than it is for real-time closures. I sure would be grateful if you could run this by the Waze devs!
DwarfLord
Wiki Master
Wiki Master
Posts: 2512
Has thanked: 1065 times
Been thanked: 1451 times
Send a message

Post by DwarfLord
Regarding vehicle-based segment restrictions -- that function the same as road closures, with an exit penalty instead of an entrance penalty -- here is an example of a workaround.

As in the previous example involving Haight, Waze has been routing drivers (presumably whose destinations were on this section of McAllister) down a Muni lane. This was counterintuitive to the marking of the segment as closed to private vehicles going that direction.

https://www.waze.com/editor/?env=usa&lo ... s=85071610

Rather than create two vehicle-based turn restrictions that would be intuitively redundant with the segment restriction, I just added a junction node a few meters from the intersection.

Since road closures behave the same, perhaps this is a good workaround for now when implementing road closures, especially one-way road closures. Extra junction nodes are fairly innocuous if they stick around after the closure is over.

Now, I don't *like* this workaround (though I like it better than multiple redundant vehicle-based turn restrictions) and I'd prefer more intuitive solutions. But the more intuitive solutions all involve Waze changing something...
DwarfLord
Wiki Master
Wiki Master
Posts: 2512
Has thanked: 1065 times
Been thanked: 1451 times
Send a message

Post by edsonajj
There will soon be no need to explain the function of the ignore traffic checkbox, this just appeared in Transifex today:
"Check this box only if the closure is permanent and Waze should ignore any detected movement"
edsonajj
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 2625
Has thanked: 70 times
Been thanked: 632 times
Send a message
Edson Jiménez

Post by edsonajj
That is too long to put in a tool-tip below the checkbox.

We can propose alternative wordings but in the end the product team will decide what to put in there. Of course we can influence that a bit through translations to make it clearer.
edsonajj
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 2625
Has thanked: 70 times
Been thanked: 632 times
Send a message
Edson Jiménez

Post by Fredo-p
sketch wrote:A number of other countries have their own closure docs – the US wasn't the first.

I guess guidance should be to contact a CM/RC and have them put it on the document, if there is one? It'd be nice to have a list of countries that have closure documents, but at the same time, I don't want to have that list go out of date and people doing manual disconnects where closures could be done instead.
To find that out I'm think that this question would need to be moved to the champs thread. You could also get great consensus as to how to make a closures page that is universal and sub pages for each country as needed.
Fredo-p
Posts: 2008
Has thanked: 240 times
Been thanked: 522 times
Send a message

Arizona Wiki | @Waze_Arizona Twitter
Verizon Samsung Galaxy S8+

Post by Fredo-p
sketch wrote:It's in the US Waze Champs forum. I think the idea is to keep the document itself to Champs and CMs because it's a pretty powerful document. We should, however, come up with a proper procedure for other editors to follow (contact a CM / US Champ / your RC).
If I may. I was brought to light about this closure doc by nnote. He informed us AZ editors on the proper way to handle road closures.

With that in mind, ply8808 made a "copy" of the actual closures doc. The copy follows the exact format as the real one. This way, if any AZ editor finds out about a closure in the time required, they input the data onto the doc. All editors have signed up to receive alerts to when the doc has been updated. This way, there isn't any wait time and the champs can go ahead and just copy/paste to the real doc.

It's been this way for nearly two weeks, I think. All closures reported have been submitted and applied in a timely manner.
Fredo-p
Posts: 2008
Has thanked: 240 times
Been thanked: 522 times
Send a message

Arizona Wiki | @Waze_Arizona Twitter
Verizon Samsung Galaxy S8+

Post by Fredo-p
Every state or RC can have a submission doc where editors can place the closures. They can then just apply it to the actual doc.

Or, I could just make an auto-fill form/doc via Google Docs that any editor can access. It would just be a series of blocks and drop down menus to fill out. The format would still produce the same results as that of the main closures doc. Then, access can be given to all Champs/CM's.

This second method could be seen as a way to ensure requests aren't lost with 50 docs to fill out. Each RC is in charge of a set number of states. I don't think they would want to have the task of going through each state's request doc.

Just thought of this, I could just make a doc for each region instead of having one major doc or 50 scattered.
Fredo-p
Posts: 2008
Has thanked: 240 times
Been thanked: 522 times
Send a message

Arizona Wiki | @Waze_Arizona Twitter
Verizon Samsung Galaxy S8+

Post by Fredo-p
The real question is, do all Champs/CMs have a Google account?
Are they familiar with Google Docs?

I'm guessing it's yes to the latter since the real doc is most likely a Google Doc. I want to ensure if centralized doc is made so editors can submit and Champs/CM's access isn't something that limits availability due to the platform its on.
Fredo-p
Posts: 2008
Has thanked: 240 times
Been thanked: 522 times
Send a message

Arizona Wiki | @Waze_Arizona Twitter
Verizon Samsung Galaxy S8+