The Wiki change came back in May 20th by Jasonh300 (not trying to throw him under the bus, just identifying people who must have been part of a conversation to remind us how we got there).

To summarize what I hear from CBenson:

Restrict Turn if:
- Always restricted
- Both commute times (morning and evening) are restricted.
- More than 1/2 of the waking day

Enable Turn if not the above assuming the driver will obey all traffic signs that can and do change beyond the map anyway.

I would agree with this philosophy with an additional restriction:
- Restrict into residential neighborhoods even if only one commute time. Locals will know how to get home already, so those who don't know the area will be forced around.

If we did we buried it too deep and created no links to it.

It looks like Germany did based on this thread. I think it slipped through the cracks for the standard English version. I will work on it this week, unless someone beats me to it. It should be pretty straight forward.

We will also be able to add the new turn restriction "?" icons once the new editor goes live.

I believe I have captured all of our discussion so far around the Soft and Hard Turns. For those interested in reviewing what I have, please visit http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/User ... Hard_Turns and feel free to either comment back here or change directly what you are confident is wrong or missing on my page.

After the new WME goes live we can update the Soft and Hard differences noting the new "?" display and change the arrow look.

After we are through with preliminary mods I can just copy this page to the standard Wiki page.

We should also confirm the new page title. Do we want Soft and Hard Turns as this article title? Other recommendations if not?

CBenson wrote:I think there is a significant difference between the statement in the OP:
"Initially all new segments are automatically created with all turns set as soft restricted turns."
and the statement in the proposed wiki:
"is generated automatically by the Waze routing engine on newly created junctions between segments."

True. What about:
"...is generated automatically by the Waze routing engine for turns from segments newly added to current or new junctions, and original base map imported junctions not set manually by an editor."
If you still don't agree, can you propose alternate text to better understand where you see the difference you want to clarify?

ncc1701v wrote:There's been discussion recently about how if a junction has soft turns, there is more than one possible continuation, and you are more likely to get an instruction for that junction. Should that be mentioned?

Are you talking about this thread? If so I missed the element you mentioned here. If another thread, can you point it out?

CBenson wrote:

kentsmith9 wrote:"...is generated automatically by the Waze routing engine for turns from segments newly added to current or new junctions, and original base map imported junctions not set manually by an editor."

Sound good to me.

I just noticed with the new editor showing soft and hard with the "?" that all the turns from the newly joined segment will be soft restricted, but the turns from the current segments to the new one will be hard restricted. Seems counter intuitive to why the new segment would be soft, but that appears to be the reality.

In that case I propose a slight adjustment to point that out
"...is generated automatically by the Waze routing engine for turns from segments newly added to current or new junctions, but the already present segments in the junction will have hard restricted turns going to the newly added segment. Also original base map imported junctions not set manually by an editor will be soft restricted."
When the new editor goes live we can add a few shots of the arrows with and without "?" to illustrate this better.

I thought I previously moved my temp Wiki page to a public view, but I guess not. Here is the current public view http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Soft_and_hard_turns of that page. We already need to update the turn arrows to show the question mark for the soft turn condition that was previously not visible.

CBenson wrote:But we should now update it with the visuals provided by the new release of the editor.

I just added the two question mark turns, but ran out of time to add the two non-question mark icons. If someone beats me to that they can add it to the page to replace the two older images at the start of that page. Once we get those we can possibly add the images to the table as well to help clarify which is which. That might be better than having them in the text above the table since they now cross over multiple ways. I think the table would be better for that visual.

I have noticed the Soft Turns work a little differently with the new editor than I remember, or I did not realize it was more complicated than I initially realized.

1. Soft turns will not appear on newly created segments or segments joined to new segments unless there were soft turns present on the original segment.

2. If a segment has hard turns on the left and soft turns on the right, if a new segment is added between them either end of the two newly created segments from the one will mirror the soft and hard turns of the original segment. Meaning the left end of both segments will hard and the right ends will be soft.

3. Once you click on an arrow with soft turns, all arrows from that segment end will turn hard with their original red or green setting. Then additional clicks on the arrow will change only the one arrow to the opposite color from its current setting cycling between red and green for each click from the prior color. The soft turns in this same junction from other segments will not change from soft to hard until that segment is selected and one of the associated soft turns are clicked.

More...

4. For intersections that currently exist, if they are disassembled and re-added, the segments moved back to the original segment will have soft restricted turns to all other segments. The original segment not moved will have hard restricted turns to the others that were moved unless they were originally soft turns to those segments and then they will be soft restricted.

Great idea for a topic.

Just a few things at first glance:

The routing engine can override anything since it's all based on penalties. Maybe I misunderstand what you wrote.

Waze does not support time based restrictions, so if it's not allowed for a specific time frame, then it's not allowed.

After creating a junction, first make sure all the one-ways & two-ways are set correctly, and then QW.

Pressing only W (without Q first) does not clear out incorrect allowed turns (including reverse connectivity). It just turns all current soft or hard restrictions off.

Extended tools "allow all turns" sets them all to soft enabled, not hard enabled.