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Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Sat Feb 06, 2016 4:26 pm
by sketch
DwarfLord wrote: Conclusions:

1. Car audio configurations can cause a 3-s delay in issuing instructions, which seems enough to lead to URs. Attempting to fix those particular URs by becoming more aggressive with junction-node placement (beyond the wiki standard), adding AGCs, etc. is probably not the best response. Unfortunately we don't know which URs might be due to this behavior.

2. Waze is said to take into account how long it will take to issue a voice instruction and to advance voice timing to compensate. The test showed no evidence that it does so, at least not with any precision. It is possible that Waze instead uses a rough guess at how long the instruction will take that does not differ from voice to voice. If so, one wonders how that affects timing of very long versus very short street names, if at all.
You're absolutely right about car audio configuration making a difference. The time required between decision to instruct and audio playback is extended considerably when the interim must contain a handoff to a Bluetooth handsfree like that.

As for 2, Waze does account for that, but I don't think in the way you're thinking. It will start speaking sooner for particularly long phrases, but it won't account for the differences in audio playback methods (Bluetooth vs. phone speaker), I don't think. Perhaps part of the reason for this is that audio routing is typically handled by the OS, not the app itself, and sometimes other apps can sort of inadvertently force Waze to use Bluetooth even if you don't want it to. I would think that Waze could at least see where its audio was being output, but whether or not they've actually programmed to account for that is a different question.

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Fri Feb 05, 2016 11:14 pm
by subs5
What happened to the listing of 170-190 for a u-turn instruction on the pie charts that show the turn and keep instructions on the TURN ANGLE section?

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Sun Feb 07, 2016 12:48 pm
by Timbones
If there is latency in the TTS instructions, then this should be fixed by Waze in the app, NOT by changing how we map the facts.

Sent from my Wileyfox Swift using Tapatalk

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Fri May 23, 2014 3:49 am
by tonestertm
PesachZ wrote:As I'm testing more, it appears any split with more than two options (I tested three and four way splits in both left and right configurations) will give the left most branch 'keep left' and all the rest of the branches a 'keep right'. This is regardless of the actual angle of the turn.
Does this hold true if one of the "right-keeping" roads has the same name as s-in?

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Sat Jun 21, 2014 1:31 am
by tonestertm
Request for a minor clarifying correction:
Junction Style Guide: Loop Rules wrote:The only work around is to either lock the segments at a higher level or ...
I'd like to suggest that this be changed to either rank or Lock level. I know the old "Level" has been changed to "Elevation", but this seems more accurate.

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Wed Sep 23, 2015 6:00 pm
by top_gun_de
Speaking for my country, there has been a process over the years. We started with simple answers, and have arrived at a point where we apply something like "fuzzy-logic".

Some key factors which are relevant:

- the "turn now"-instruction shall never be so late that turning the wheel is illegal or unsafe.
- the turn now shall not be so early that there is confusion between alternative exits
- if traffic is expected to stand on the straight lane or the ramp (ie due to traffic lights), short ramps are preferable to reduce errors from misplacement after gps issues
- if ramps are preceded by distance poles, drivers appreciate a match of displayed data with real-world signs.

For us, that means that we start freewayramps shortly after the beginning of the striped line, and that we start ramps on major highways late if we expect drivers to stop for more than a few seconds. The rest is somewhere in between.

Your local mileage will vary, based on national or local customs.

Best regards,

Detlev

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Thu Sep 24, 2015 7:00 pm
by top_gun_de
codgerd wrote:
top_gun_de wrote:For us, that means that we start freewayramps shortly after the beginning of the striped line, and that we start ramps on major highways late if we expect drivers to stop for more than a few seconds. The rest is somewhere in between.
Interesting. So the accepted usage in Germany is to put the junction node at the start of the striped line (with exceptions as described in your post).

We have, therefore, two end-member solutions apparently in common usage:
1. junction node is placed at the beginning of the gore (where the striped line dividing the exit lane from the roadway changes to solid)
2. junction node is placed at the beginning of the exit lane, where the striped line first begins

and we have the current wiki guidance, which is in between these two solutions, although much closer to (1).

kentsmith9 tells me that changes have been proposed for this section of the wiki. Is there any way to view these proposed changes to see the new proposed guidance under consideration?
As I said, there is no simple answer. We only do this on freeways, any other ramps have their nodes further behind.

I listed aspects which are actually partly in a conflict.

I can't speak for other countries, but in Germany, we never have traffic lights or planned stops on Freeways. In Russia, it's different, as I know from experience. These differences show why it's no possible to make global stAndards when there is no global standard for road construction, traffic rules and driver's habits.

Best regards,

Detlev

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Thu Oct 01, 2015 4:45 am
by top_gun_de
You are discussing a US-specific fork of the page?

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Thu Oct 08, 2015 4:32 am
by top_gun_de
Back in the days of Windows Mobile, audio latency was a big issue for navigation. This may well be a driver/hardware issue., not simply a platform issue.

Re: [Page Update] Junction Style Guide

Posted: Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:05 pm
by voludu2
RE: Loop Roads

I would like to clarify, organize, and simplify this section:
https://wiki.waze.com/wiki/Junction_Style_Guide#Loops

As follows:
  1. If this is going to be a loop discussion, it should lead with two images -- a dead-end loop and a loop with at least two segments sticking out of it (like a u-shaped side street). The definition of loop would make more sense in that case.
  2. I want to make "two segment loop" prominent, something we can link to for beginning editors.
    I want a single term to facilitate better communication
    I see the term "Same Endpoint Drivable Segments" (SEDS for short?) in validator
    I see the term "same connection segments" in toolbox
    Some respected senior editors don't recognize that term. Makes communication difficult.
    "Two Segment Loop" is simple English, and is very close to the phrase already used in this wiki page.
  3. According to the definition of loop given here, a roundabout is a type of loop. Any list of loops should contain roundabouts.
  4. It does not belong under "dead end roads". The definition of loop currently given includes loops that are not dead ends
  5. It doesn't even really belong in "junction style guide" A loop is not a kind of a junction, and is not directly related to controlling turn instructions. I would like to explore the possibility of finding a new home for this material, somewhere other than "junction style guide".