[Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Sun Jun 29, 2014 3:22 am

I do see now that I misinterpreted the originally-quoted wiki guidance. It is saying it is OK to set the U-turn restriction to green on a highway that is NOT split in Waze but is divided in reality. Which is why davielde responded that such situations are discouraged as well.
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Sun Jun 29, 2014 9:34 pm

In an offline but timely discussion I was told, in the case of U-turns demanded on a road divided in reality but not split in Waze, that I should consider splitting it in the neighborhood of the junction, making a bowtie, and enabling the hard left. Interesting! OK, so here is my suggested modification to guidance:

Suggested new U-turn guidance wrote:NOTE: As of this writing (June 2014) Waze does not produce any voice announcement for U-turns. It may consider and use U-turns in routing but it cannot instruct the driver to perform one. Due to the confusion this could cause among drivers, the current policy is not to enable (set to green) the U-turn restriction under any circumstances whatsoever. Keep all U-turn restrictions red everywhere, even in cases where local law or signage permit U-turns, and regardless of whether drivers are complaining that U-turns should be enabled. Of course, at such time as Waze implements U-turn voice instructions, this policy will likely change.

In the meantime, if U-turns are demanded for proper routing in the specific case of a road divided by a median strip but not shown as split in Waze, the recommended approach is to split at least a short section of the road near the intersection and use a bowtie with the hard left turn enabled. This effectively allows U-turns using a "turn left" voice instruction.


For reference, the current language says:

Existing U-turn guidance wrote:NOTE: The U-Turn doesn't have a proper navigation announcement (i.e. "Make A U-Turn"), but it will still route you that way. The current policy is to disable all U-Turns UNLESS the road is a divided highway that doesn't meet the requirements to be split.


Concurrence?
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Mon Jun 30, 2014 2:14 pm

OK, I have made the changes to the turn-restriction part of the Map Editing Quick-start Guide using the {{As of}} template.

In addition to the text, I used the {{As of}} template to add prohibitions in the table of turn icons. So you have a nice picture of a green U-turn arrow, a nice little description of what it does, and then big boldface text that says never use it.

Comments still quite welcome. I just wanted to get this out as it was a point of tremendous confusion. This kind of thing is just horribly counterintuitive to me and I felt it deserved more explicit documentation.

I wonder if non-red U-turn arrows should be added to WME Validator so we can identify and eliminate them more effectively?
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Mon Jun 30, 2014 3:07 pm

kentsmith9 wrote:If true, this is really sad because so many people have been setting U-Turn instructions in the streets of SF one by one to get them ready when it works. This guidance says to disable all of them and start over when it comes back.

That's why I couldn't believe it at first, and why clarifying the wiki was so painful. I've done my share of meticulous U-turn setting with careful Street View inspection when I thought the feature was supported, which was until quite recently. The idea that we are to rip it all out is just horrible beyond words. But that appears to be current consensus guidance.
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Mon Jun 30, 2014 5:35 pm

qwaletee wrote:either Waze NEVER gives a U-turn instruction because it can't, in which case, why all the fuss about making sure they are all disabled? Or, Waze CAN give such an instruction, but rarely does (never seen it documented), in which case, why aren't we setting them up correctly?

If I follow what others are saying, Waze CANNOT give a voice announcement for a U-turn, but it CAN provide a route that requires one. If both were CANNOT, or both were CAN, everything would be fine.
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Thu Jul 10, 2014 5:19 am

There are three separate issues actually.

There is the issue discussed in this thread where Waze will provide a route that requires a U-turn but will not give any instructions to do so, which is mind-bogglingly confusing to the driver. There is also the completely separate issue where, if a U-turn is enabled at the dead end of even a long road, Waze seems to enjoy sending drivers all the way down the road to do the U-turn even when better choices are available. Then finally there is the workaround for dead-end roads, which is to disable U-turns at dead ends by selecting the dead-end node and pressing 'q' (there is no longer any visual indication that you've succeeded unless you're running the WME Validator plugin).

You're right that we can't do anything about the first two issues, but if we know where the dead end was that had the U-turn enabled, an editor can at least implement the workaround.

If the drive you took is still in your "recent drives" list, accessible from a tab on the left of the WME window, then you should have little trouble finding the street involved...?
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby DwarfLord » Sat Jul 12, 2014 10:09 pm

There's a fair bit of discussion on it in the WME v1.6 release - (v169) release thread.
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby Fredo-p » Thu Jul 10, 2014 1:21 am

purposeguy wrote:FYI, I was routed down a dead end street with a U-turn at the end two days ago. I'm running a V3.7.8.0 client. There was no U-turn symbol on the screen and no voice prompt for a turn at the end of the street. It was definitely looking ahead to the next turn.


Could you provide a permalink to the location of your drive so a local editor can look into this u-turn issue?
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby karlcr9911 » Thu Dec 25, 2014 1:54 am

purposeguy wrote:I've since been "on patrol," removing U-turns wherever I find them.


It's not necessary to remove the 'legal' ones you find, which is stated in the u-turn wiki guidelines...FYI

https://wiki.waze.com/wiki/Turn_restriction#U-Turns
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Re: [Clarify/Update Page] U-turn policy?

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Jun 30, 2014 7:56 am

Just be sure to use the {{As of}} template so we can find this guidance in the future since we know it will eventually change.
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