How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

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Re: How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby DavidRa » Sun Sep 05, 2010 5:08 am

I believe it's about converting intersections to traffic lights, much as we do for roundabouts. This will improve voice routing, among other things.
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Re: How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby DavidRa » Thu Sep 09, 2010 9:39 am

Allow me to explain why I thought it could help with navigation.

Have a look at this map (obviously incomplete):

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You're driving south on "Seven Hills Rd" and intending to continue without turning off - though not being a local, you don't know that yet. Leabons Rd intersection is actually a set of traffic lights (not the roundabout - old aerial shots). As you curve left, right at the top of the map, you're told "In 800m, at the roundabout, continue straight."

Frankly a set of lights is of more importance than a plain intersection - I'd prefer to be told of the lights rather than the roundabout far beyond them. A non-local needs to hear "In 200m, at the traffic lights, continue straight" followed shortly thereafter by "In 200m, at the roundabout, continue straight".

Also consider "in 200m turn left" - I'm not sure about other countries, but many streets in Australian capitals have a parallel laneway adjacent the street - it serves for loading docks and delivery points for those buildings. So given this layout (the plus is a plain junction, the asterisk is lights):

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             | |
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=============+=*
--> travel --^


The annotation "at the traffic lights" clarifies whether the main street or the laneway is required. Note that the difference between the laneway and the street could be as little as 25m (75 ft). Hardly enough for an ordinary person to differentiate from 200m away.

Finally, this also may make it easier to have navigation rules such as "avoid traffic lights" or "prefer traffic lights to unmanaged intersections".
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Re: How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby fvbommel » Wed May 02, 2012 6:43 am

bgodette wrote:However I agree with Jason in that it would be really helpful if we could mark certain turns as "legal, but a really bad idea" as a hint to the routing server. With enough historical data, this isn't a problem, but there's a catch-22 in that the majority of users have more than air filling the space between their ears and will not take a clearly bad route and Waze will take a very long time collecting that data.

Well, if users fairly consistently ignore Waze's suggestion to take a certain turn (optionally: at a certain time of day), shouldn't that also be pretty interesting data? :)
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How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby fvwazing » Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:42 am

For all that it's worth: Waze recognizes TL right now. Stopping, waiting near a junction, different waitingtimes for going in different directions. What more do you need? Ok, you do not hear directions like "at the next trafficlight, go right" but that would not justify the extra trouble, in my opinion.
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How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby fvwazing » Thu Sep 23, 2010 8:07 pm

Automatic recognition is the way to go; all necessary data can be extracted from driving patterns. Editing a light at a crossing does not help; the editor should provide Waze with the "phasing" of the light as well. 10 seconds red/50 seconds green is better than 30 seconds/30 seconds; but depending on traffic density a 60 second/60 second phasing could be better...

Waze could, if equipped with the right algorithms and enough data, bring this down to an accurate prediction of time spent on consecutive roadsegments. Having the lights on the map does not help in accuracy, only raises the complexity for the editors, of which there are far too few anyway. Besides, I know of crossings with 30 to 40 lights working in concert. Good luck editing that AND expecting a better accuracy than by recognition (which alas is not done by Waze - yet).
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How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby fvwazing » Tue May 01, 2012 10:13 pm

it would not be necessary to record trafficlights or tedious turns if Waze learned speeds of segments taking into account the next segment traversed.
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How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby fvwazing » Wed May 02, 2012 7:39 pm

Great to hear that it now works that way!

fvbommel wrote:
bgodette wrote:However I agree with Jason in that it would be really helpful if we could mark certain turns as "legal, but a really bad idea" as a hint to the routing server. With enough historical data, this isn't a problem, but there's a catch-22 in that the majority of users have more than air filling the space between their ears and will not take a clearly bad route and Waze will take a very long time collecting that data.

Well, if users fairly consistently ignore Waze's suggestion to take a certain turn (optionally: at a certain time of day), shouldn't that also be pretty interesting data? :)


In the past, I have conducted tests that seem to suggest that Waze DOES use that. The preference for a turn WAS decremented to the point where it simply would not get suggested anymore. Because I ignored the turn on consecutive days around the same time the turn was not suggested at that time of day for some time after... But I did that test as we still had daily updates, currently the lag in the system makes this... different. Also, it could be that ONE wazer using an often ignored turn resets all negative preference.
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Re: How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby gerben » Wed Sep 22, 2010 5:39 am

My thoughts exactly. Over here most intersections on major roads are H or # shaped. And those are typically the intersections with lights.

Way to complicated to get this working good.
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How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby jasonh300 » Tue May 01, 2012 9:20 pm

Having done a lot of editing around Los Angeles,!i think it would be a good idea to be able to mark uncontrolled left turns.

There are a lot of places where a left turn is technically legal but impossible most of the time due to traffic.


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Re: How about adding Traffic Lights/Signals

Postby jvdmeer » Tue Sep 14, 2010 6:03 am

I think traffic lights are a good idea. Ofcourse we don't have to draw every single light in Cartouche, But just a properties box at a junction with a checkbox.

I think that it provides better route-calculations by providing (for example) a 15sec fine for junctions with traffic-lights. And the spoken directions can be improved also as earlier stated.

Maybe, someone should post it on uservoice
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