Route Timing for UR in Pickering, ON

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Route Timing for UR in Pickering, ON

Postby e-sarge » Wed Mar 18, 2015 9:20 pm

I could use some help resolving a route timing issue for this UR in Pickering, ON.

Local knowledge (specifically mine and the UR OP, but I'm sure other locals would agree) indicates that the longer route should not be chosen unless there were some issue on Hwy 401 causing a backup, since this is just after the collector lanes open up and traffic normally frees up in this area of the 401, and therefore just based on speed limit difference (60 km/h vs. 100 km/h) plus the extra light at Whites, the longer route would almost never be the faster route (except, as I said, if there were a traffic event on the 401).

Using LiveMap and isolating to the shortest possible route that includes the routes described in the UR, I had already determined that a certain times of the day, Waze would take the longer route, which actually includes an extra light cycle for a left turn at the busy intersection of Kingston Rd and Whites Rd and has a longer distance traveled on 60 km/h roads vs. 100 km/h speed limit on the 401.

I installed the WME Route Speeds script to debug further, and have some odd results. If you want to duplicate my results locally, set your A point to -79.108937, 43.823042 (on Kingston Rd) and B to -79.121862, 43.812278 (should be on the 401 Collector Lanes). The shortest route should be the first ramp onto the 401 at 1.66 km, the next longest will probably be via Whites Rd at 1.74 km.

Here's my problem: Segment cross-times don't add up to the total travel time from A to B ... not even close.

If I set the day to Tuesday and the time to 08:00 (one of the times that produces seemingly bad results in LiveMap), the numbers for the shortest route don't add up (neither the average speed or the trip time, if you set the Show Cross-Times option). For speed, I get 38+58+99+95+118 for the 5 segments, yet the average shows 39.2 km/h. For cross-times I get 21+35+13+14+7, which adds up to 90 seconds, but the total time shows 2:33, 63 seconds more than the sum of the segments. Why are these numbers so far off? This "unaccounted-for" 63 extra seconds for the shorter distance route is no doubt why Waze is routing to the slightly longer route.

On the longer segment I get the opposite effect: 23+30+13+43+7+32+7=155 seconds, but the displayed total A to B time is 1:32, 63 seconds less than what it should be. Very interesting that they are both wrong by the same number of seconds... could the routing engine be "getting its wires crossed"???

Clearly I don't understand how Waze routing engine works internally (does anyone, really? ;) ), but can anyone explain why the individual segment cross-times would not add up to the total time?

After posting here, I do plan to post a link to this thread in the Waze -scripts Slack to draw in some help. If you know of other forums or individuals that should be linked in, please do so or let me know so I can.

Thanks,
Roy.
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Re: Route Timing for UR in Pickering, ON

Postby e-sarge » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:11 pm

Call for help has been posted on the WME Route Times thread in the script forum.

I have also noticed that even from the same computer/browser, that you don't often get the same results from WME Route Times (even though you ask for the same specific day of the week and time). However, as you said, the results are slightly different than what I post, but not different by a significant amount. I suspect that this minor variance originates on the server, and not in the script itself.
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Re: Route Timing for UR in Pickering, ON

Postby e-sarge » Mon Mar 23, 2015 4:41 pm

@wlodek76: Thanks for letting me know about the option to click the routes. Yes, that definitely helps clarify routes. It seems for me that initially the script displays cross-times for all routes, then when I click on a specific route it hides the other route cross times. It did show me that I was adding the totals for the wrong segment, so in fact the totals were not significantly different than the sum of the individual segments (within 2 seconds, probably due to rounding). As I stated in my original post, I didn't think the script was the problem, but the real problem is/was on the server.

And, as you suggested, I will attach a screen shot next time so everyone can see exactly what I saw.

So now we have established that it was actually me who had my wires crossed (newbie to using the script :oops: ), and the times were actually 2:33 for the second ramp and 1:32 for the first ramp. However, the mystery remains why LiveMap was actually recommending the second ramp at that time, despite it being over a minute slower.

Now I have re-tested today, and I see that LiveMap is currently recommending the first ramp at all the times I checked. I will check again tomorrow with LiveMap (since I originally did the research for the UR on a Tuesday).

Thanks for the support so far. I will post back again with the Tuesday results.
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Re: Route Timing for UR in Pickering, ON

Postby hmarian » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:10 am

Hello Roy,

When I test the times and distances from point A to B on the route speed script I get slightly different times and speeds than you mentioned.
I'm not expert with the script, but it might be that the way it interact with the Waze data is vary.
I suggest that you ask this question in the script forum. If there is a n issue with the script it is likely not unique to Ontario.

Cheers,
HM.

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