Historic Data

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Historic Data

Postby sublimese » Thu Oct 11, 2012 10:55 pm

When I tell Waze to take me from my home to my work in the morning, it appears to not take historic data into account.

For example, let us say I have 2 routes I could take to get to work. Route A and Route B.

Route A is the route I would take when I know there is no traffic (night, weekend, holiday, etc...). When there is no traffic, or when traffic is flowing at optimal levels, this route takes me 35 minutes. On a typical work-day this route takes 55-60 minutes.

Route B is the route I take on a normal day. Route B when there is no traffic takes 45 minutes. On a typical work day this route takes 50 minutes.

Route A, during rushhour is ALWAYS slow. Additionally, there is a huge on-going construction effort on this route that always causes additional delays. In 2 years of taking Route A during a normal work day, I have NEVER had it take less than 55 minutes to complete the trip.

For a week now, at 7:15am, I tell Waze to take me to work. Every morning Waze wants to take me down Route A. Every morning it tells me Route A is going to take 35 minutes. This is wrong. During the work week, Route A will NEVER be this fast. Route A is NEVER the fastest route.

Does Waze not take historic data into account at all? Waze should know that by 7:30 most of Route A will be heavy traffic and the commute time will increase accordingly. Why should I keep using Waze if it insists on guiding me down the slowest route. If I have to constantly ignore what waze is telling me....whats the point?
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Re: Historic Data

Postby AndyPoms » Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:00 pm

Have you checked Route B for map errors?
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Re: Historic Data

Postby sublimese » Thu Oct 11, 2012 11:19 pm

Route B appears to be fine.

The reality is that there are many routes to take, and Waze dutifully chooses what it thinks are the 3 best. Of the 3, it always has Route A as its top choice and always shows a commute time of 35 minutes. (Route B never makes the list, despite the fact that I have manually choosen to drive it every day since I started using Waze). The only time Route A 35 minutes is when there is a complete lack of traffic. In the 50 year existance of Route A, there has never been a time that there has been a lack of traffic during rush hour on a work day.

Why then does Waze always say Route A will take 35 minutes?

Route A == I-25 in denver, south bound, from I-70 on the north end to C-470 on the south end. Every day this stretch of highway has heavy, slow traffic. Every day its full of waze users reporting heavy traffic and slow downs. Every day Waze tells me to travel this stretch of highway.
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Re: Historic Data

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:37 am

How often have you driven route A, purposely getting caught in the slower traffic so that Waze learns that this route is slower? Just because it might know how fast Route B is doesn't mean it has the data about route A in order to make the right choice.
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Re: Historic Data

Postby bgodette » Fri Oct 12, 2012 6:02 am

I'd like to know what route B is because every single destination I've set inside the 470/nwp loop and into central Boulder has been accurate to +/- 2 minutes even during rush. The only times I've had it be inaccurate is when an accident has just happened or there's something that doesn't happen at the same time on the same day of week (sports, presidential debates, stolen tanks, etc).

It's all my phone's fault for using Tapatalk.
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Re: Historic Data

Postby CBenson » Fri Oct 12, 2012 2:23 pm

I've had basically the same problem for last couple of days. I'm 99% convinced that my issue is not a map problem, but a routing server problem where the current/historic traffic info is not correctly taken into account. Interestingly, waze has been rerouting for me, so it is only the initial route calculation that seems to not take into account the traffic. Haven't really been able to verify that traffic is not taken into account in the initial evening route I receive, but it seems clear to me in the morning that the initial route is not taking into account the traffic data.

bgodette wrote:I'd like to know what route B is because every single destination I've set inside the 470/nwp loop and into central Boulder has been accurate to +/- 2 minutes even during rush. The only times I've had it be inaccurate is when an accident has just happened or there's something that doesn't happen at the same time on the same day of week (sports, presidential debates, stolen tanks, etc).

Wow. For my route into DC the ETA is never accurate to within 15 min. My ETA always creeps up by at least 15 min during my drive in. (Always being since the ETA has been constantly displayed.)

Stolen tanks?
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Re: Historic Data

Postby sublimese » Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:35 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:How often have you driven route A, purposely getting caught in the slower traffic so that Waze learns that this route is slower? Just because it might know how fast Route B is doesn't mean it has the data about route A in order to make the right choice.



Why do I need to drive route A? Isn't the entire point of Waze that we are crowd-sourcing traffic? If route A is currently full of waze users, does waze really need me to also drive down route A so that it can tell me that that route A is bad?
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Re: Historic Data

Postby sublimese » Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:43 pm

bgodette wrote:I'd like to know what route B is because every single destination I've set inside the 470/nwp loop and into central Boulder has been accurate to +/- 2 minutes even during rush. The only times I've had it be inaccurate is when an accident has just happened or there's something that doesn't happen at the same time on the same day of week (sports, presidential debates, stolen tanks, etc).

It's all my phone's fault for using Tapatalk.



Please re-read what I have written. I have never wrote that Waze's data for route B is bad. The problem is that route B (even though it is the fastest) is never given to me as an option by Waze. Waze ALWAYS tries to take me down route A (or some variation of route A) despite that fact that route A is always slow.

For those that really want to know....
I live in North Arvada CO. I drive to the North end of the Tech Center
Route A == Kipling south -> I70 East -> I25 South -> Belleview (50-70 minutes)
Route B == Kipling south -> I70 West -> C470 South -> 285 East -> Happy Canyon South (45-50 minutes)

Waze only gives me the choice of Route A (or a few variations on it) and tells that that Route A will only take 35 minutes. You try driving route A during rush hour and tell me that it only takes 35 minutes.......
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Re: Historic Data

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Mon Oct 15, 2012 2:49 pm

sublimese wrote:Why do I need to drive route A? Isn't the entire point of Waze that we are crowd-sourcing traffic? If route A is currently full of waze users, does waze really need me to also drive down route A so that it can tell me that that route A is bad?

Not necessarily, no. If you can see that Route A is "full" of Wazers, I would think it would have valid data. I didn't see that you mentioned this about the other route earlier, hence my suggestion, but now that I think about it, with A being I-25 in Denver, I'd think the data is fine.

I know there are several editors in the Denver area, so that road should be just fine, as should route 'B' in general. Route length is something which can affect the road type which Waze will prefer to use which we have no influence over. At certain distances (I cannot recall specifics at this time), Waze will try to not route on anything less than primary street except to get you to one, and off of one near the destination. Longer distances and even Primary Street isn't preferred over highway/freeway. Your list of streets looks like highway or greater for the middle sections, which, again, should be fine for routing even for longer routes.

What is the total distance for your route B? Chatting with bgodette about it may be of use too, as he should be pretty familiar with the area.
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Re: Historic Data

Postby bgodette » Mon Oct 15, 2012 4:00 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:
sublimese wrote:Why do I need to drive route A? Isn't the entire point of Waze that we are crowd-sourcing traffic? If route A is currently full of waze users, does waze really need me to also drive down route A so that it can tell me that that route A is bad?

Not necessarily, no. If you can see that Route A is "full" of Wazers, I would think it would have valid data. I didn't see that you mentioned this about the other route earlier, hence my suggestion, but now that I think about it, with A being I-25 in Denver, I'd think the data is fine.

I know there are several editors in the Denver area, so that road should be just fine, as should route 'B' in general. Route length is something which can affect the road type which Waze will prefer to use which we have no influence over. At certain distances (I cannot recall specifics at this time), Waze will try to not route on anything less than primary street except to get you to one, and off of one near the destination. Longer distances and even Primary Street isn't preferred over highway/freeway. Your list of streets looks like highway or greater for the middle sections, which, again, should be fine for routing even for longer routes.

What is the total distance for your route B? Chatting with bgodette about it may be of use too, as he should be pretty familiar with the area.
The data on 70, 470, 25, 285 (Hampden) and 85 (Santa Fe) will be fine, and like I said Waze is consistent in +/- 2 minutes for my daily which is SE Aurora to Downtown. All site visits have been +/- 2 minutes to where my "driven" area covers pretty much all of the metro. Based on the description of Route B it might be running into a traveled vs straight line as all parts of B other than Kipling north of I-70 and Happy Canyon (Primary) and the actual destination are Minor or higher.

There is also the unknown about how far back the historical averages go, and how much weight any newer data has if any.
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