Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby wolfsbane2k » Thu Jun 26, 2014 9:52 am

We have a similar issue here:
https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... 09&env=row

where the petrol station is on the roundabout, but doesn't get drawn on the signs. It looks like PealRinger and I have inadvertently umm'd , ahh'd and see-sawed about this one as well, as we end up with the junction numbering being off as well.
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby Twister-UK » Thu Jun 26, 2014 12:56 pm

Timbones wrote:
Twister-UK wrote:I thought sharing roundabout nodes was still a no-no due to the risk of triggering a 0th exit error?

No it doesn't, it just messes up the node counting.


Good to know, thanks.
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby CTCNetwork » Thu Jun 26, 2014 7:48 pm

Hi,

Yes, I have had this experience on the A610 roundabout (Nuthall Island). A central road exists but if it is connected and you follow the A610 through to nottingham you get a 4th exit for the exit onto the A610 and a raft of UR's complaining that it is the 3rd exit for the A610 when it actually isnt. Most people discount the exith thy have driven past that is on the inside of the roundabout.

So actually it does work, it just depends on your perspective and point of view.. :D

Des. . . ;)
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby Xenon2020 » Wed Jul 02, 2014 11:21 am

I noticed this problem yesterday. Personally I would not count Under the Wood as an exit on the roundabout. Coming south on the A404 it is very easy to miss the exit to Under the Wood and therefore would not be counted as an exit by most users. Therefore taking the 3rd exit when coming south most would head towards Marlow as this is the 3rd exit on the road signs.
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby Twister-UK » Wed Jul 09, 2014 12:42 pm

I've now moved Under the Wood onto the same node as the A308 exit, which should restore the "correct" exit count in the client instructions without also preventing correct routing into or out of UtW (as was the case in the layout prior to my earlier edit). Let's see what sort of feedback this revised layout generates...
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby Twister-UK » Wed Jul 23, 2014 9:18 pm

OK, so something isn't right here :? Following the original merging of the Under the Wood and A308 exit nodes, the client was giving me 0th exit errors. I checked the roundabout and noticed one segment was defined A-B whereas all the others were B-A, so decided to rebuild the entire thing just to be sure the data was clean.

As there have been several tile updates since this last bit of tweaking, I'm assuming the roundabout now in use by the client and livemap is this latest revision and not the earlier, visually identical, version. Yet I'm still seeing the 0th exit error in the client and also in the route instructions returned by Tim's route checker script...

Help!!!
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby MsDizzie » Sat Aug 02, 2014 10:35 am

Spotted a couple of URs and I've made them aware that the 0th exit problem is being investigated. I've pointed them here to follow the discussion.
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby NorfolkMustard » Sun Aug 17, 2014 8:48 pm

I drove this roundabout today, coming south on the A404. Still not giving a numbered exit, voice or visual, guidance on approach.

In my view it would be fine for under-the-wood to be a separate exit. It's a surprise when you see it, but when you do then the exit number waze has given you will make sence
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby Twister-UK » Mon Aug 18, 2014 6:45 am

NorfolkMustard wrote:I drove this roundabout today, coming south on the A404. Still not giving a numbered exit, voice or visual, guidance on approach.

In my view it would be fine for under-the-wood to be a separate exit. It's a surprise when you see it, but when you do then the exit number waze has given you will make sence


Given that this was how I'd mapped the roundabout back at the start of this thread, I'd be only too happy to stick UtW on its own exit again, thus both matching the real-world geometry of the junction and clearing up this unexplained 0th exit error.

Except we'd then be back to square one as far as having to deal with countless URs from people who don't like the idea of the exit count in Waze not matching up with the exit count they've calculated from looking at the signs on the approach to the roundabout.

If we could resolve this 0th exit problem then I'd be happy - although it wouldn't be a wholly accurate rendition of the roundabout, it'd be the one which generates the least amount of URs.

Since the roundabout shouldn't be behaving like this, and since it IS behaving like this even after having been completely torn down and rebuilt with new segments, perhaps it's something the Waze team could look at?
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Re: Is it Acceptable to Map a Roundabout Incorrectly?

Postby CABuzz » Fri Sep 05, 2014 4:39 pm

Hello all,

I have looked over the Waze forums and I can't find an example of a working roundabout which has a similar layout to this one. The working roundabouts that do have a shared node seem to have a unique exit to that node, e.g. a one way segment entry before a two way segment or two one way segments (entry and exit). In these situations Waze can explicitly determine the exit and hence the numbering works. Here there isn't a unique exit and the routing algorithm for whatever reason doesn't like this. I agree this situation should work but only Waze HQ I guess can tell you why it doesn't. This is only my observation and may be totally incorrect and be some other bug.

In the meantime, should this junction be turned back to how it was originally? Connecting Under the Wood to the southbound A308. So that at least users get given exit numbers, correctly or incorrectly depending on their opinion.

Alternatively, what about extending the entry from the southbound A40 and connecting Under the Wood to the same node. I have driven this route quite a few times and it is quite easy to miss the Under the Wood exit, on the A40 Southbound. By doing this Under the Wood becomes a left turn instruction from the A40 southbound which there is a signpost for, near the roundabout. The exit numbers then become the same as signposted Southbound A40, which I am guessing is where most of the previous URs about exit numbers came from.

For other entry points users then have "more time" to see the Under the Wood exit and count it. Just my guess that will bring the least number of URs.

There is almost certainly something I have missed with this solution, but I would be interested to hear the thoughts of more experienced editors.

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