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Holland Tunnel and Lincoln Tunnel Toll Problem

Post by gtr225
Hello all, I am having an issue with Waze avoiding tolls properly. When I route a trip from my home in Jersey City, NJ (lets say Kennedy Blvd and Thorne St) to Hudson Street & Houston Street in Manhattan I get two different routes when I change the avoid tolls option even though both routes cost the same. With avoid tolls selected, it always routes me through the Lincoln Tunnel. I figured there must be traffic in the Holland Tunnel, however last time I made this trip, out of curiosity I turned off avoid tolls, routed again and this time it sent me through the Holland Tunnel. Both routes were exactly the same, one was tried immediately after the other, the only difference was I turned off avoid tolls. For those who don't know, both tunnels are toll roads and both cost exactly the same. I don't know why waze does this, perhaps it is because only the toll plaza of the Lincoln Tunnel is marked as a toll road and in the Holland Tunnel, half of the actual tunnel is marked as a toll road. So perhaps when Waze avoids tolls, it takes the length of the toll road into consideration as well. I would be more than willing to help fix this, however both tunnels are locked for editing so perhaps some ideas from the veteran Wazers could help.
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Post by CBenson
Waze is not going to work well to route to locations that require a toll if you have the avoid tolls setting on.

My current understanding is that waze chooses the route with the fewest segments marked as toll segments.

There remain some significant issues with the avoid toll routing. It has not been that long since waze would have given you a route over the non-toll outbound lanes of the Lincoln Tunnel to avoid the toll. However, there are still some documented issues like this occurring around the world. Waze is still working on improving the avoid toll road routes. Accordingly, I think it is a bit premature to try to adjust the map to the current toll road avoidance results.
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Post by CBenson
I haven't actually heard anybody complain about this in quite awhile, so I was hoping it had been addressed. Sorry to hear you are still experiencing the same issue.
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Post by CBenson
It still seems to me that you can be routed over the Lincoln Tunnel by taking this one toll segment. So it seems to me that waze routing may still simply prefer to route over the fewest toll segments. I still wonder if we made it so you only traversed one toll segment for each Hudson crossing, whether waze would then route you the fastest route into Manhattan if you had "avoid tolls" on.
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Post by CBenson
Sure.
I've unchecked the toll box there. If that allows routing through the Holland Tunnel with avoid toll roads on, then we should look at all the Hudson crossings and see if we can consistently make them use a single toll segment.
PhantomSoul wrote:From what I understand, only the segment that actually passes through the toll collection point should have the toll road check box checked.
My understanding is the opposite, that all segments that cannot be traversed without paying the toll should be marked as toll. However, that was to facilitate marking toll roads in on the client map which has not happened. If routing works better with only the segment that actually passes through the toll collection point marked as toll, then I would suggest changing our approach, at least for NYC.
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Post by CBenson
Well removing the extra toll segment from the Holland Tunnel has had the desired effect. I can now route through the Holland Tunnel with "avoid toll roads" on. It seems to me that at least for the river crossings around NYC it would be best to just mark a single segment where the toll is collected as toll so that each penalty is equal when you have "avoid toll roads" set to on.
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Post by CBenson
I don't know. It wouldn't really apply in Baltimore as the Patapsco isn't long enough. If you have avoid tolls on, waze simply won't route you over the Key Bridge or through the tunnels as there are many untolled alternatives further northwest. Besides there aren't really any other tolls to avoid, so there's not much reason to have avoid tolls on in Baltimore except to avoid the tolled river crossings.

Still, there does seem to be some reason to mark only the segment where the toll is collected (at least where there are multiple facilities to cross a common barrier like a river). The reasons for marking all segments that you can only reach by paying the toll, have never been implemented. Maybe we should start a new general thread to address this issue again.
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Post by CBenson
Accounting for cost is not something I'm expecting anytime soon. Many new toll roads down here are congestion priced meaning the toll rises as more people take the road. Even the tolls that are not variable over time tend to have some discount for commuters that use the facility frequently. It would be a significant undertaking for waze to take into account all the different toll options around the world.
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Post by gtr225
Ok thanks for the info
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Post by gtr225
Any update on this? I would think a solution is it should count a continuous segment without exits, entrances, or intersections as one toll and choose the fastest route.
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