Trans-Canada highway

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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:42 am

I can see both sides of the argument here, but as long as Waze does not show dirt roads in the client, I think gravel roads should remain as roads types. Gravel roads are a fact of life in Canada and I feel that once there is sufficient data in Waze, people should automatically not be routed down gravel roads. This also comes down to driver common sense, if you are traveling from A to B, you shouldn't have to drive down a gravel road at any time unless you're traveling to a farm or establishment in the middle of nowhere, in which case you likely already know where you're going.

For the purpose of contradicting myself, Waze will likely only be used in an urban settings, or for traveling from one urban area to the next. In which case, we want to ensure people always remain on the paved roads and make all rural roads dirt roads. This would consistent with the wiki, I just wish that the type was 'unpaved road' rather than 'dirt road'.

A third option, would be to delete dirt roads from the map altogether and classify gravel roads as 'dirt roads'. This may be our best option as long as Waze does not have a gravel road type.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:48 am

I also summarized what we concluded with in regards to the Trans Canada Hwy in my first post. If anyone has any objections, let me know. I did this so that others wouldn't have to sift through the thread to find our concluding thoughts on the matter.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby doctorkb » Thu Dec 13, 2012 4:53 am

I'd like to point out that dirt roads still show in the client. It is their name that isn't shown.

And if you're driving along and see a road is coming up, and then you approach an intersection, both in Waze and real life, there's little doubt that you're looking at the same thing... There won't be another intersection for another mile or so.

Also, there are suburbanites (eg me) who go out to friends' farms on occasion. It would sure be nice to have a navigation app that will get me there mostly on pavement, with only the necessary gravel excursion.

I think we have to consider the surroundings, which makes this a similar discussion at the TCH question. If we are talking about an area like, say between Ellerslie Rd and Hwy 19 (Leduc to Devon), then a different standard should apply than in the middle of freaking nowhere, where the best road for tens or hundreds of miles is semi-annually oiled gravel.

As for conclusions on the TCH, lets update the Canada page in the wiki, or at least its discussion page.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Thu Dec 13, 2012 5:04 am

doctorkb wrote:I'd like to point out that dirt roads still show in the client. It is their name that isn't shown.

And if you're driving along and see a road is coming up, and then you approach an intersection, both in Waze and real life, there's little doubt that you're looking at the same thing... There won't be another intersection for another mile or so.

The fact that gravel roads appear in the client changes things, but I'm still beginning to side with my third option in my previous post. Aside from (rough) short cuts or access to remote fields, I can't think of why we'd ever want the client to direct people down a dirt road. Might be best to delete dirt roads and make all the gravel roads 'dirt road' road type.

I think we have to consider the surroundings, which makes this a similar discussion at the TCH question. If we are talking about an area like, say between Ellerslie Rd and Hwy 19 (Leduc to Devon), then a different standard should apply than in the middle of freaking nowhere, where the best road for tens or hundreds of miles is semi-annually oiled gravel.

Agreed, but I think the only difference should be that a paved road in the middle of nowhere, that isn't a highway, should be classified as a primary road.

As for conclusions on the TCH, lets update the Canada page in the wiki, or at least its discussion page.

I'd update the wiki, but I've been unable to login to it ever since I signed up on Waze. Not entirely certain why.
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Last edited by james_8970 on Thu Dec 13, 2012 7:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby doctorkb » Thu Dec 13, 2012 6:30 pm

hurley108 wrote:First, I apologize for undoing what you'd done without discussing it. That was rude of me and I shouldn't have.


Thank you.

However, this is something that needs to be done with care and caution.

If we don't manage to get all of them, will Waze simply route people along those that aren't done, leading to longer treks on gravel road than are necessary?

If people do get a long way out onto a gravel road, but then miss a turn or something, will it be a hinderance that they cannot see the road names on the map in the client? If, as you say, everything that is not paved should be made dirt, and we apply this to secondary highways, then we could really make it difficult for people to see where they are. It could also deprive Waze of a way of efficiently routing people out. Is this dangerous? Really could lead people into a situation like in Australia.

Gravel roads are a fact of life in rural Alberta, just about anywhere off the highways (or even on some). We should proceed with caution before embarking on a mission of turning every gravel road to Dirt Road.


In an attempt to conduct the scientific experiment efficiently, let's do a small area, not just one segment.

I'd propose that the area I had started with (between Hwy 19 and the Anthony Henday / Hwy 627, between Hwy 2 and Hwy 60) be converted to the discussed types -- let's see how that works out. Ideally, Waze will route people to Hwy 19 or 60, or other primary streets.

As an aside: one or two of the "Primary Streets" that are out there are impassible -- e.g. 141 St south of the Creekwood Chappelle development.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:58 am

Should Hwy #2 be a freeway type south of Calgary? I feel that it should only be classified as a freeway between Edmonton and Calgary. South of Calgary and North of Edmonton I feel that it should probably be a major highway.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby doctorkb » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:22 am

james_8970 wrote:Should Hwy #2 be a freeway type south of Calgary? I feel that it should only be classified as a freeway between Edmonton and Calgary. South of Calgary and North of Edmonton I feel that it should probably be a major highway.
James


There's some freeway-ish parts just north of St Albert. Not sure how far it goes, though.

I've not been on it south of Calgary... Is it divided?
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:57 am

Yeah it is. You can make an argument for a freeway type up till Nantor, at which point I'd downgrade it to Major Highway.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby james_8970 » Tue Jan 08, 2013 3:40 am

Have you guys conducted your experiment, what did you guys find? How do you guys think we should handle rural roads? I noticed Waze added a new setting, in regards to dirt roads, to 'avoid long ones'. I personally think that maybe we should turn all gravel roads into dirt roads and simply remove dirt roads altogether. They normally aren't all very navigable, especially if you have someone trekking down rural roads in a car.
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Re: Trans-Canada highway

Postby geoffb » Thu Jan 24, 2013 3:47 am

Who is the person changing all the street names involving the Trans Canada to completely unintelligible abbreviations with secondary and tertiary names appended on the end? Not only is it impossible to read, but when spoken it either comes out wrong or takes forever to say.

I don't want to see "to Hwy 1 W / 16 Ave N / city centre," mainly because it displays poorly on the app but also because it takes 8 seconds for the Waze voice to say it.
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