HOV lane navigation

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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby attheyard » Wed Nov 21, 2012 11:03 pm

HOV usage rate is both city and time-dependent


Note "time dependant" is not just the rate of use; the road is only HOV for certain times during the day, as opposed to 24 hours. When the road is non-HOV anybody can use it. Typically the HOV restriction is only for 2-3 hours a day during the rush hour.

But if I am a visitor to that area on a business trip, commuting in the morning with all the locals, and am totally unfamiliar with the situation, I may decide to trust Waze in such a "mature area" and might get routed onto an HOV lane, recognize it too late and get fined.


Also a relevant point. I noted earlier that thru travelers would have a hard time making the decision that is obvious to the locals, as to whether or not to get on the HOV. The same is true for visitors. This is exactly why I don't understand the I66 setup-if you get on I66 inside the beltway as a non-HOV driver, you WILL be fined. There is a cop sitting at every exit checking cars. Driving east on 66, there is a split in the road where you can either continue on 66 (but the entirety of 66 is now HOV), or you can exit onto the beltway around the city. The beltway around the city is almost never faster, but you have to do it if you're alone in the car. Waze doesn't know this. So why is I66 left as a routing option?
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby attheyard » Thu Nov 22, 2012 2:07 pm

attheyard wrote: The beltway around the city is almost never faster, but you have to do it if you're alone in the car. Waze doesn't know this. So why is I66 left as a routing option?


This is not quite true as it depends on where you are going. If you are going TO DC, it's a lot different than if you are going AROUND DC. I would never downtown if going from Fairfax to Annapolis, the beltway is always faster if traffic is moving at speed. But if going to DC before or after the HOV restriction time, I would take I-66 as it is faster


True, this should have been qualified; if you are going to the other side of DC (a la Annapolis to Fairfax) the beltway is likely faster. But if you are going into DC and stopping, the routes are very different.

It seems that the current system is probably the best possible way to do things. If waze were to implement HOV road marking similar to toll lane marking in the future it would be nice.
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HOV lane navigation

Postby bigbear3764 » Thu Oct 04, 2012 1:24 pm

Do you have a permalink to the problem area? Probably needs a turn restriction at start to avoid.


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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Thu Oct 04, 2012 6:12 pm

I have changed the exit lane in question to a parking lot road. This should solve the problem.
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Wed Oct 10, 2012 9:55 pm

attheyard wrote:I understand the theory but if it is a parking lot road waze does not understand how to exit when you are in the HOV lane. You need to be able to get OFF the HOV as well as prevent getting on it. A turn restriction would better accomplish this goal.

Hmm, yes that is an issue isn't it. The problem is that many exits are not reversible, so they are simply marked as ramps. This means that waze will not route you off of a reversible entrance/exit marked as a parking lot road. Mike1323 has changed the entire HOV lane to parking lot and has changed the ramp back to ramp type. Presumably in response to this thread. I believe that should work. This also answers the question as to why its better to make the entire road a Parking Lot road rather than just the ramps.

attheyard wrote:Also with the parking lot road, how are you to know the HOV is an option if there is a serious accident on the main road? It's impossible. Anyone who lives in that area knows enough to avoid the HOV if it's closed-there's a gate in front of the lane, or if they can't use it-not enough people in the car. If you go another way, waze can handle the re-route. For these reasons I do not agree with making the ramp a parking lot road.
I don't understand why this has any impact on the parking lot / turn restriction choice.
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Sat Oct 13, 2012 9:06 pm

It seems to me that it will be appropriate to mark the HOT lanes as a toll road.
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:23 am

I'm not sure exactly what's happening to the HOT lanes. What happens to the HOV lanes inside Edsall Rd.?
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Thu Oct 18, 2012 6:54 pm

MysticCobra wrote:
attheyard wrote: If waze had a separate setting like toll roads for HOV's, the user could turn them on or off as routing options.


I think this is the key. We should have an option to use or not use HOV.

There are some issues to solve because the HOV restrictions vary. First, the number of vehicle occupants required to access the lanes is not consistent across the region, so its possible to be eligible to use some HOV lanes but not others. Second, the I-95/I-395 lanes are reversing lanes. So we need to be able to both designate the road as HOV and also designate when the road is open in the appropriate direction.

MysticCobra wrote:I would still like to see, when looking at route choices, this a certain route is Express or HOV or Toll or whatever with some sort of icon or asterisk or warning.
I don't use toll roads enough, but think that waze is doing this for toll roads. We'll have to wait and see what is developed for HOV lanes. I'm not sure a separate road property is warranted for express lanes. Most of the express lanes around here do have the express designation in the road name, so it may show on the route designations at times.
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Thu Oct 18, 2012 8:01 pm

MysticCobra wrote:I think designating the beltway Express/HOT lanes as a separate roadway IS warranted especially since 1. the speeds will likely be very different and 2. there are new exits/ramps that are ONLY for getting into and out of the Express Lanes (Jones Branch, Westpark, Gallows). These can be huge time savers.

Makes sense to me.
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Re: HOV lane navigation

Postby CBenson » Wed Nov 21, 2012 10:55 am

I think you make good point regarding the 95 HOV lanes. The more I think about this, the more I agree.

attheyard wrote:So, if waze tells you to take the HOV lanes, and the gate is closed, it will automatically reroute you because you will have to make a distinctly different turn. This is significant, because in other places where the roads are close together, waze doesn't necessarily know what road you're actually on: If waze says to take 495 thru across the woodrow wilson bridge and you take local instead, waze won't figure it out until you exit because the roads are so close together and there is not a significant turn to take one or the other.

I think this is the key point. I don't think the current HOV mapping policy is driven by reversible roads so much. Rather, the question is if waze routes over the HOV lanes and the gate is open, will the driver understand to not take the HOV lanes. However, this is exactly what happens with 66 inside the Beltway. 66 is time restricted HOV only inside the Beltway. 66 is simply marked as a freeway and waze routes everybody on it regardless of their HOV status. Those driving alone need to understand to take a different route. I'm not sure why we should do the same for the 95 HOV lanes.

I guess the other significant question is whether the waze HOV policy needs to be consistent. In other words if the VA editors decide that making the 95 HOV lanes routeable makes sense, do you need agreement from the rest of the waze community.
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