why no left turn at intersection

Moderator: Unholy

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:54 pm

Its a routing algorithm issue.
The live map shows the routing algorithm's fastest route. But waze routes fine if the navigation type is set to shortest.
Bluebonnet.jpg
Bluebonnet.jpg (25.75 KiB) Viewed 2798 times

Thus, I do not believe that any correction to the map is warranted. My understanding of the issue is that with the speed data that waze has, waze has calculated that on average it is faster to take the right/U than it is to wait at the light to make the left turn. Sometimes you can fix this by actually driving the U route so waze gets better data.

I'm not sure that this is considered a "problem" to be fixed, as based on the waze data it seems that it is the fastest route.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:33 pm

But you don't have the data that waze uses to make the calculations. Waze has said that the average speed data available in the editor is not the base data that the routing algorithm uses. Waze keeps data on how long it takes to go each direction at the end of the segment. So waze has data on the difference for turning right compared at least to going straight and left, that you are not accounting for in your calculations.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:43 pm

bz2012 wrote:I think another possible 'fix' is to make the 'crossover' on the long route a 'parking lot road'.
Any objections to this?

I don't think this is a good idea. First, its not really a parking lot road. Second, from a routing perspective, you might as well simply remove it rather than making it a parking lot road. If you make it a parking lot road, I don't think it will ever be used for routing.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 5:48 pm

I think its likely a combination of:

1)
bz2012 wrote:along with waiting for a chance to make that 'U' turn safely.

As no one likely makes the U, waze likely doesn't have good data on what that wait is, and thus may well be severely underestimating this wait.
and
2)
bz2012 wrote:Granted, there may be a 'right on red after stop' advantage, at that intersection that we are not seeing.

Waze likely does have data showing the right is on average significantly faster than going straight/left.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:25 pm

bz2012 wrote:I don't really think WAZE should EVER route people via a 'U-turn' when there is another way to get there.

Ok, but it seems to me that is an argument for removing the segment as U-turns are its only function.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Sun Mar 24, 2013 6:39 pm

Agreed. Those are the factors to balanced. Although, I don't think waze will route through a parking lot segment to get to an address on the northbound segment. I think waze will just skip the segment and go to the next to make the U-turn. But as you say, we don't really know.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Mon Mar 25, 2013 10:48 am

jemay wrote:I have resolved things like this by rebuilding each junction node (disconnect each segment and create a new junction node (don't drag the old junction back in). After that I never got the u-turn route again...

I suspect you're just destroying the speed data showing the right is significantly faster than the left.
I have one (discussed here) that has been repeatedly torn apart over the past year and put back together by different editors. URs show the intersection will occasionally route right/U again.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: why no left turn at intersection

Postby CBenson » Mon Mar 25, 2013 11:20 am

bz2012 wrote:STRANGE.

Not too strange, it was a cut and paste error that I saw and corrected.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: Levels and ramps and bad routing oh my!

Postby CBenson » Thu Mar 28, 2013 7:37 pm

I doubt it. There are occasionally reports that changes in things like name or level affect routing and there may be some minor effects. But in general the level should not affect the route.

On the other hand, there have been a large number of reports, many recent, of waze routing straight/U rather than a simple left. I think the issue is that waze knows that there is an average delay to make the left onto the ramp, but as no one passes the ramp to make the u-turn, waze is not accurately guessing how fast the u-turn is.

Waze seems to able to route correctly. So it seems to me to be more likely to be an issue with the speed data than an issue with the levels. However, the levels don't really do much anymore, so I would go ahead and change them and see what happens.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

Re: Levels and ramps and bad routing oh my!

Postby CBenson » Thu Mar 28, 2013 8:20 pm

So I happened to refresh the tab with the route open and it gave me the U-turn, when it was giving me the simple left earlier.
MacFarland.jpg
MacFarland.jpg (39.1 KiB) Viewed 1483 times
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Altantic, US
Verizon, Droid Turbo, Android 4.4.4, Waze 3.9.4.0
CBenson
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 9031
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 745 times
Been thanked: 1798 times

PreviousNext

Return to Navigation & Routing

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users