ply8808 wrote:The users avatar is still visible even when invisible mode is toggled and does not support a stalking mode, what most believe is stalking is really the necessary oversight and management of editors.
I find the invisible mode useful for when I am AFK, it allows my user name to be removed from the chat list so others know I am not available, yet allows me to view the chat upon my return and catch up on anything I may have missed.
I do find it helpful to find an out of way area to park my avatar in these AFK/invisible moments so others do not feel I may be "stalking" or my avatar is covering a working area of an editor.

*Edit* I may stand corrected on the invisible attributes, please read this thread as there is some discussion in regards.
viewtopic.php?f=276&t=89344&start=90

Copied from other thread

PesachZ wrote:

DwarfLord wrote: Looks like PesachZ has the answer for me. I must be turning it off all the time when loading permalinks. Thanks PesachZ!

Perhaps over in the WME feature requests area I'll suggest that the Live Users layer be forced perpetually on. If an one's avatar really is always visible regardless of one's "invisibility" setting, it is puzzling why anyone would want to be seen without seeing. It's not like there are so many other editors they would clutter the screen

invisible removes your name from the list, you essentially log out of the chat and can view as a guest. your avatar is also removed (doesn't update on the live users layer). so if I go invisible, jump to you, leave all while invisible, you will not see my avatar even if you have live users layer on. this is confirmed.

Perpetually on isn't good either as it may interfere in viewing the map when there are multiple editors crowding a scene during a discussion/informal mentoring, there's an editor hovering over a feature you want to see (say a specific node or turn restriction arrow), our you choose not to participate on WME chat and don't want to be diatribes by setting avatars jumping across your screen.

If you use scripts you'll find they are also turned off when loading a permalink which was created without them, or with them off. it's just a function of how pls work. You override this by modifying the PL before loading the page to remove the layer section.

Take this PL

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https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat=35.59604&lon=-108.61566&env=usa&layers=1189

remove the layer section &layers=1189, if it's not at the end it's between the two "&" symbols, delete one of them. then navigate to the link and it will retain your layer defaults.

Like this

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https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat=35.59604&lon=-108.61566&env=usa

Removing the invisible option won't prevent stalking, unless you link it to the live users layer. Otherwise a user could turn off chat and still stalk (just without the ability to jump to another user location). You'd still be able to monitor what other editors are doing with chat off using other methods like the last updated by date and name stamp on each segment. There are even scripts which can point out recently edited segments by specific editors. The "stalking" as you call it has always happened, it was just more tedious and took longer to notice novice/malicious editors making incorrect edits. Using this method expedited the process of nipping bad edits in the bud, and then possibly working with the editor to correct the issues.

If a specific editor is abusing the tool and not following the etiquette put forth in the wiki, like any other abuse, it should be reported to the RC, or a GC to deal with and mediate/arbitrate.

As mentioned over there by ply being invisible also had it's own benefits such as being AFK and not showing in the chat list so people know you are AFK but still preserving the chat history, not crowding up another editors screen during informal mentoring when you are just watching, and the avatars are being used to point to segments etc.

The users avatar is still visible even when invisible mode is toggled and does not support a stalking mode, what most believe is stalking is really the necessary oversight and management of editors.
I find the invisible mode useful for when I am AFK, it allows my user name to be removed from the chat list so others know I am not available, yet allows me to view the chat upon my return and catch up on anything I may have missed.
I do find it helpful to find an out of way area to park my avatar in these AFK/invisible moments so others do not feel I may be "stalking" or my avatar is covering a working area of an editor.

*Edit* I may stand corrected on the invisible attributes, please read this thread as there is some discussion in regards.
viewtopic.php?f=276&t=89344&start=90

i thought i had new request but it seems this issue has been rolled out for sometimes.
I am agree to disabling invisible feature in chat box for L1-L3.

some suggestion for chat box is: when we call someone name the chat box will automatically maximized.

with better communication hopefully there are less false map editing and better community.

The suggestion is not to get rid of it all-together, just not make it available to editors under L2. This means that managers can still stalk the weak, but those who need to be kept an eye on can be observed as they go about their business.

I'd like to add that the chat window should not be allowed to be minimized and to lock live users on for that reason, too. Many don't know it's there and/or ignore it so don't see that we're trying to get their attention.

I would prefer to keep this option, as I rarely turn on chat while I am working. I use Waze Slack, so the chat is virtually useless to me. I do not want it on and chiming at me when I am busy or people trying to talk to me when I am not there.

As a level 2 editor and an Area Manager, I use invisible mode as mentioned above-- being able to go AFK without showing in the chat, monitoring any new editors in my areas, etc. I particularly like reading over the chat I missed when AFK, as I have learned a lot of good stuff that way.

At a minimum, I don't think invisible should be blanket removed from Level 2, as some (like me) have been promoted to Area Managers, and monitoring editors is a responsibility of that role. Sometimes stealth is necessary to do that properly. But I can understand the desire to remove it from other low ranks.

Recently, there was a level 1 editor that said in chat that they did not want to be monitored, and kept going to areas away from their editing area when they would go visible to write in chat, so it was harder to identify where they were editing. Their editor profile showed 10% of their edits being deletions, so that was a cause for some alarm, not to mention their evasiveness and behavior in chat.

A possible idea for low editors that were forced to be visible would be to have WME Chat automatically go invisible when you're AFK for an extended time (e.g. 20 minutes?), but return to visibility when editing resumes. Something like that could possibly become a preference option (but not mandated) for higher level editors as well.

Lastly, on the chat "always on" idea, I don't like that. Screen real estate can be limited for many, especially on laptops. However, I think a compromise would be to pop the chat window up when "@editor_name" is used. I'd even be okay with limiting that capability to low ranks, so that high ranks aren't harassed by people in chat this way. But it is definitely frustrating trying to reach a low-ranked editor that has closed chat. It could also be a preference item for higher ranks if they don't mind having it pop when somebody pinged them.

That's my 2¢. Don't spend it all in one place.

I have not yet participated in raids so I didn't realize (though it makes sense now that I think about it) that they grant AM privileges to raiders, so yes, that would make it complicated. While monitoring editors with stealth is ideal in some cases, a point could be made that Rank 2 editors coaching Rank 1 editors may need to be observed by higher AMs, SMs, etc., as well. So I agree with uscwaller.

I particularly agree with their suggestion about the banner or some kind of popup idea, rather than just bringing up the chat. That would keep it less intrusive, but it would not be able to be ignored.

lopaolo69 wrote:No sorry: the invisible mode allow managers to check what users are doing, particularly bad users
Never remove it.

Paolo

You're not reading this properly. We're talking about lower rank editors.

I agree with most of what skyviewguru said. Invisible has its advantages, as stated above, watching over new editors etc. I do think however that level 1-2 editors shouldn't have this ability AM or not, in map raids everyone is technically an AM regardless of rank. Lastly I would like to see some kind of banner/popup for when your editor name/highlight words are used, something that doesn't necessarily make the chat window open but doesn't disappear until you open the chat window.


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randcon wrote:I'd like to add that the chat window should not be allowed to be minimized and to lock live users on for that reason, too. Many don't know it's there and/or ignore it so don't see that we're trying to get their attention.

That is indeed an issue. When users don't check forum PM's and you see them on the map, they often have no idea either that they should open the chat window.

Two or three times already I had to create Places or Roads on WME that I named "PLEASE OPEN THE CHAT WINDOW AT THE BOTTOM RIGHT, I AM TRYING TO SPEAK TO YOU" in an area the editor was working on to get his/her attention.

Then I have to delete it all of course but there really should be something done so that new users can get notified that someone is trying to communicate with them.

I don't think that preventing to minimize chat is a very good solution for people on already small screens. But rather a sound or visible warning for the selected user. (Like some scripts already do).