Un-named segments for better navigation

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Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Timbones » Wed Mar 20, 2013 10:59 am

[Long post warning - originally posted to Navigation Experts forum]

I've been experimenting with the use of un-named segments to get better navigation instructions. The rationale is thus: when Waze shows a turn onto an unnamed segment, it gives the name of the following segment instead. This can be useful in a number of scenarios:

Freeway/Highway Split
When a freeway or highway splits in two, you often need Waze to give keep left/right instructions for both continuations. The Junction Style guide suggests using 'wayfinder segments'. An alternative approach we've been trialing in the UK is to use a blank segment before the split, and then naming the following segments as per the road name.

Example: M1 / M621 split will give these two navigation instructions, which are easy to match against road signs:

  • Keep left to M1 (N)
    or
  • Keep right to M621 (W)

Split Ramps
When a single ramp exits from a Freeway, and then splits into two different directions. Often it is helpful to know which of the split ramps you will need before leaving the freeway. By leaving the first ramp un-named, Waze will do exactly this. This gives the driver plenty of notice to read the signs and get in the correct lane as soon as possible. They will then get another instruction to keep left or right once they've entered the ramp.

Example: M4 (W) to M25 will give one of the following two instructions to exit the Freeway (streetview):

  • Exit left to M4 (W) J4b to M25 (S), then
  • Keep left to M4 (W) J4b to M25 (S)
    or
  • Exit left to M4 (W) J4b to M25 (N), then
  • Keep right to M4 (W) J4b to M25 (N)

Example: The A1 (M) / M62 Interchange has no names on any of the connecting segments, and all routes through the junction will give the correct names. For each set of directions, the driver will see the name of the freeway that they will be driving on to before they leave the previous freeway.

To illustrate, this route* will give the following instructions: (*ignore out-of-date Livemap, and instructions from addon)
  • Keep left to A1(M) (S), then
  • Keep right to A1(M) (S)

Double Roundabouts
Sometimes 1 roundabout just isn't enough, so road designers put in two with a connecting link road in between. There's often not enough time to give appropriate instructions to allow the driver to get in the right lane while navigating between the two roundabouts. By leaving the link road un-named, Waze will give the name of the exit road of the second roundabout before the driver has entered the first. This gives the driver plenty of time to read the road signs and move into the appropriate lane.

Example: Hopgrove Roundabout has two roundabouts and a short link between them. As you approach the junction from the south, you really do need to be in the right lane (streetview). Here, Waze will give three possible sets of instructions:

  • At the roundabout, take the second exit to A64 (E)
    or
  • At the roundabout, take the first exit to A1036 - Malton Rd, then
  • At the roundabout, take the first exit to A1036 - Malton Rd
    or
  • At the roundabout, take the first exit to A1237, then
  • At the roundabout, take the second exit to A1237

Traveling in the opposite direction, e.g. from A1237 to A64, Waze will say which direction to go before the first roundabout:

  • At the roundabout, take the second exit to A64 (E), then
  • At the roundabout, take the first exit to A64 (E)
    or
  • At the roundabout, take the second exit to A64 (W), then
  • At the roundabout, take the second exit to A64 (W)

Pictures!

hopgrove1.png
A64 to A1237
(253.78 KiB) Downloaded 1528 times

hopgrove2.png
A1237 to A64
(32.62 KiB) Downloaded 1528 times


Caveat: TTS will not read out the name of the following segment, but it does display on the client.


Does this make sense? Can anyone see any problems with these scenarios? Is there any other scenario where un-named segments could be useful?

:ugeek:
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:38 pm

I don't see any problems with your scenarios. They look to be a great description of the advantages of unnamed segments and make great sense. I don't think the unnamed section before the highway split is going to catch on around me because typically we are adding the control cities in the names at split so the instruction is not simply the highway name.

As far as other scenarios go there is the classic segment between carriageways of the split highway where the cross street changes name at the highway.

I also wonder if no name segments are useful to force prompts at street splits as well as highway splits. For instance at this intersection, without the unnamed segment traveling south on Arundel on the Bay Rd you get no instruction when staying left, but do get a "stay to the right at Thomas Point Rd" instruction if going straight. I'm wondering whether adding the no-name segment will cause instructions (both ways) if staying on Arundel on the Bay Rd. It seems to me this is exactly the same principle as you are using on highway splits (but with instructions in both directions to consider).

Lastly, I don't understand your caveat that TTS will not read out the name of the following segment, but it does display on the client.
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby dmcconachie » Wed Mar 20, 2013 1:58 pm

CBenson wrote:Lastly, I don't understand your caveat that TTS will not read out the name of the following segment, but it does display on the client.

I think this was specifically with regard to the double roundabouts!
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:11 pm

So in the first screen shot you don't get a equivalent TTS instruction "at the roundabout take the first exit at A1237?"
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby davipt » Wed Mar 20, 2013 2:29 pm

dmcconachie wrote:
CBenson wrote:Lastly, I don't understand your caveat that TTS will not read out the name of the following segment, but it does display on the client.

I think this was specifically with regard to the double roundabouts!


Correct. I can confirm that on double roundabouts with or without name on the connected segment, when arriving at the first roundabout the TTS does not say the name of the road leaving the second roundabout, only when arriving at the second one.
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Timbones » Wed Mar 20, 2013 4:46 pm

^ Yeah, what he said. ^

I think this is because there are more than 1 unnamed segments before the next named one, and TTS can't/doesn't look beyond the next one. The other scenarios with only one unnamed segment should be okay.

I've not tested the M62 / A1(M) example I posted above (with many unnamed segments), so I don't know if that'll read out all road names or not. If that example does work, then it might be the roundabouts that disrupt TTS.

Edit: no, it's not just roundabouts that have this issue.
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Wed Mar 20, 2013 7:20 pm

I'm going to guess that its the roundabouts that disrupt the TTS as I'm not familiar with many double roundabouts. If I recall correctly I have been in parking lots with unnamed segments where I get multiple TTS instructions that recite the name of named road after the parking lot exit as I am routed through the parking lot.
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:23 pm

CBenson wrote:I also wonder if no name segments are useful to force prompts at street splits as well as highway splits. For instance at this intersection, without the unnamed segment traveling south on Arundel on the Bay Rd you get no instruction when staying left, but do get a "stay to the right at Thomas Point Rd" instruction if going straight.

I can now confirm that the no name segment does trigger a keep left if traveling southbound on Arundel on the Bay Rd. Traveling northbound from either Thomas Point Rd or Arundel on the Bay Rd gives no instruction when continuing on Arundel on the Bay Rd. due to the slight angles. This seems to be ideal to me.
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Timbones » Thu Mar 28, 2013 11:35 am

I've heard from another user than TTS doesn't speak the following road name when there are multiple un-named ramps before the next named segment (here). The client display does show the next name though.

Any further thoughts on this? Is this an approach we want to see used more often? Should I move/copy this thread to the main Editing forum?
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Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Thu Mar 28, 2013 2:02 pm

Yes, I do believe that this is an approach that should be used where appropriate. Seems like broader discussion in the Editing forum is warranted.

Surprised about the silence for multiple unnamed segments. Is that something that should be raised with waze as a bug?
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