waynemcdougall wrote: And finally, while @Unwallflower is right that all the information is there if you want to just go and fix it all yourself.

But it ain't too pretty IMO. I know there is a group tasked with getting some good map editing documentation. If I had thought ahead yours would have been a great case study. But writing documentation is slow, we're all unpaid volunteers with lives and jobs, so it will be weeks away

Will be great when it's done. And if you feel inspired you'll be able to contribute and improve it too, as it will be wiki based.

You're right, it's not pretty. However, with all of the work you've done on the wiki I think it is definitely better than it was when I started out... and hey, I've figured everything out okay!

At least all the information is there. And while I think we definitely do need a good map editing tutorial, what we do have right now is a very helpful community that can answer any questions you might have. Once you get the hang of it, map editing is a piece of cake (and addicting like cake, too).

dalesd wrote:Here's a link to a map along my route.
http://www.waze.com/livemap/?zoom=8&lat ... yers=BTTTT
I drive south on East st., left onto High Plain (rt 27), right onto Providence Highway south (Rt 1), ramp on left to I-95 south, to 495 North to 290 West.

It's not a very clean looking map. Not that I'm saying that;s the cause, but we'd want to eliminate it as a confounding variable. Especially if Waze is trying to find an alternative route and then gets confounded by illogic and gives up with a timing error. I think I've seen cases like that.

I've changed Lorusso Rd to be twoway (being a no-exit road) and allowed right hand turns into East St.

No road allows turns into Meadow Lane. Can you really not turn west into High Plain St from Washington St? So most of the roads off High Plain St don't have turns enabled at the junctions.

Hmm, ok so they've never been updated. You've been lucky to get a Base Map with street names. Haven't seen that before.

Sorry this is becoming stream of consciousness, but it's past my bedtime

Ok, so here is a real problem. The one-way Provide highway south bound also allows a turn into High Plain St. I've fixed that, but it will take a while for the routing server to learn that. And of course that may be completely unrelated to your problems (most likely it is not at all related, but we should eliminate it)

Hmm, Waipo Street is at the same level as the I-95 - I don't think that's right. I'll put Waipo at level -1 to go under the I-95

Does S Walpole St really go UNDER the I-95 Southbound lane and OVER the I-95 northbound lane?
Same question for S Main St?

Oh dear, more problems on the I-95 south bound south of S Main St. On this one-way road we have segments connected in both directions. That ain't good. Fixing that too...

Bah, and another double connectivity just south of the offramp to Commercial St. That's why I hate unnecessary junctions, but I don't have permission to remove them. Fixing it....

And again...fixing it... Ok, it's wrong in patches everywhere...I'll just keep fixing it...note that I'm only checking southbound....remove those unnecessary junctions and you wouldn't have this tedious problem....

Ok, the road segment just past the ramp connecting the I-95 to the 495 west is also connected backwards along the one-way road in the wrong direction past the ramp. Fixing that too. That ain't good.

Does the I-495 really intersect with South St? I think those junctions should be removed, and the levels changed. But I haven't done it, because I don't know the area. http://www.waze.com/cartouche/?zoom=5&l ... 1=22518256

Same deal with Spruce St a little further west...

Also is I-495 and West St supposed to intersect?

And Great Pond Rd? And Summer St? And Washington St? And Beaver St? And Maple St? And Farm St? And Main St, Milford? and Haven St? And Wood St? And Flanders Rd? And Main St Southborough? And Northboro Rd? And Forest St? And Elm St?

If not, then the levels of the roads need to be set appropriately.

Ok, more two way connectivity on a one way road the I-495 westbound...fixing it...and more...I'll just fix them all with no further comment...but I haven't checked I-495 Eastbound

Sigh. The whole Washington St, I-495 has the wrong connectivity, and that's just westbound...

There's something truly horrible southbound on the I-495 here that I will leave for you to fix:
http://www.waze.com/cartouche/?zoom=6&l ... 1=22859484

Yup, the I-290 has two way connectivity on one-way roads as well...fixing that for westbound only...

Nearly all the on and off ramps have incorrect connectivity...

Ok, you also need to resolve the levels and intersection status of the I-290 (westbound - I haven't looked at Eastbound) for:

Whitney St, Green St, Reservoir St, Gulf St, Southbridge St, Sword St

And here's another mess where I-290 southbound and northbound have been joined by a junction:
http://www.waze.com/cartouche/?zoom=6&l ... 1=22865672
I don't have permission to fix this

It's also badly joined a few 100ft south of that point.

And that takes me to the end of the I-290 westbound. Whew.

In summary, the map is so poor in this area, I wouldn't blame the client for any routing rejigs until the map is cleaned up. I may have done enough to get a clean route in the one direction once the Live map updates flow through to the routing server and your device.

The following is all great advice for @unwallflower and I'll add that you will find
http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Deal ... _the_roads

helpful. You have the names of the roads already, but all the other advice directly applies.

unwallflower wrote:dalesd - I just took a look and you are not the area manager (for information sake, a user named "mhennessy" is). I'm not sure where Wayne got that idea.

To answer your question, the better forum to discuss these issues (because you are right, they are not android issues at all) would probably be the "map" forum, or the "editing" subforum.

The neat thing about waze maps is they are user-generated and user-maintained. Your area started out with base maps, but they are obviously not perfect and need to be edited to optimize routing in your area. All the inconsistencies you are noticing (the things that are incorrect on the map) aren't due to conventions on the map that you are unaware of. They are errors, and they need to be corrected (or "edited," if you will) or you are going to keep experiencing poor routing. Alternately, you could not correct them and let the system "learn" from you driving around with waze on, but that could take quite a long time and will not improve your routing in the meantime.

The obvious best solution is to edit the map yourself. I'm not going to give you a dissertation on map editing, I'll just link you to the wiki and let you educate yourself. I would start here: http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Best ... g_practice

And then continue your reading here: http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Map_Editing

And if you have any questions along the way, feel free to ask. We're mostly helpful here.

dalesd wrote:

waynemcdougall wrote:I've changed Lorusso Rd to be twoway (being a no-exit road) and allowed right hand turns into East St.

Yup, that's right. Many of these roads like Lorusso (small residential developments) are shown as one way roads on the map. In reality, they're not. Is this some convention on the map that I'm not familiar with, or are these errors?

These are errors.
http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Deal ... amed_roads explains the background.
In short, waze got a supply of map information (a Base Map) , but to be safe marks all the roads as No Entrance. Then as people drive along them Waze learns if they are one-way or two-way. If it's partway through the learning process (which can take a long time especially on seldom used roads), then roads may be marked oneway because that's the only direction Waze has seen someone drive on it.

So you can fix them, if you are so inclined.

dalesd wrote:

waynemcdougall wrote: No road allows turns into Meadow Lane.

There are no turn restrictions onto Meadow Lane.

This is really important Just because roads physically touch on the map dopes not mean they are connected from a routing perspective. That's a good thing in a lot of cases. In the examples below we have the freeway going over or under roads, but Waze doesn't know about the over or under (yet) and might just think you can make a right hand turn in the middle of an overpass.

So every road needs to be connected. That's pretty easy. In the map editor, you can click on the junction of East St and Meadow Lane, and then on the Edit menu click on "Enable all turns". Done. Now rinse and repeat as necessary. You don't have to do the whole city, but you do have to do your route (and any alternative route) - the more you connect up, the better the routes (and alternatives) you can get.

Now Waze will eventually learn that a turn is allowed - if you drove from East St to Meadow Lane every day, within a month at most it would enable the turns for you. But us impatient people edit the map.

dalesd wrote:

waynemcdougall wrote:Can you really not turn west into High Plain St from Washington St? So most of the roads off High Plain St don't have turns enabled at the junctions.

It's a 4-way intersection at High Plain and Washington, with a traffic light. There are left turn only lanes on Washington St (northbound and southbound), but otherwise no turn restrictions, other than No Turn on Red (IIRC).

So you would just enable all turns at that intersection too.

dalesd wrote: The map shows a bunch of short unnamed roads at the NW corner of the intersection of High Plain and Providence Highway. They're not really there. It's just a gas station.

Marking gas stations is useful. If you get really fancy you can add a gas station landmark. But it's useful to tidy up the roads (maybe just have one central in and out lane, with junctions connecting to the main roads, and make the road type a parking lot road with the name Gas Station. That way you can route to it, navigate from it, but Waze will not suggest going through the gas station as a short cut. And while you're at the gas station Waze won't think you're stuck in traffic on the main road.

dalesd wrote:95 goes under S. Main.

So when roads go under or over another, we can edit the Road Details to set a level - this is just a relative level - we don't want Waze to ever think two roads are connected when they go over or under each other. So it's just a matter of making sure every road that crosses has a different level. It makes sense that lower roads have a lower number. And you have a nice range from -5 to 9.
[/quote]

dalesd wrote:

waynemcdougall wrote: Does the I-495 really intersect with South St? I think those junctions should be removed, and the levels changed. But I haven't done it, because I don't know the area. http://www.waze.com/cartouche/?zoom=5&l ... 1=22518256

Same deal with Spruce St a little further west...

Also is I-495 and West St supposed to intersect?

No, none of those intersect with 495. I'm not sure if they go over or under.

And now you can have a fun little editing job to get it right.

Low priority task, but it would be great if you can help. Feel free to just do the part covered by your route. So you can pay attention as you drive along, or find a map that shows the overs and unders,

dalesd wrote:Now that I've had a chance to see the sausage getting made, I can hardly blame the client.

But I fear I have put you off. For me, my goal has just been to edit the routes (and alternatives) on the routes I travel. My city didn't even have a base map. When I turned Waze on it was completely blank. I didn't have a clue. Forunately some great people built an entire city, and I've made some small contributions later. It doesn't take too long. Anyone can do a good job map editing.

To do a great job you have to be a bit pedantic and meticulous and like map editing. But that doesn't have to be you. Every contribution someone makes can be built on and made better. And you can chip away at it a little bit at a time.

Freeways can be a mess until they get sorted, but once that is done they work very well. But Waze won't be offering you alternatives until the alternatives get connected up. But just driving around with Waze turned on helps. It is still learning road speeds, and learning what connections should be open, and identifying where the map is inconsistent with your driving track and flagging that for correction.

And finally, while @Unwallflower is right that all the information is there if you want to just go and fix it all yourself.

But it ain't too pretty IMO. I know there is a group tasked with getting some good map editing documentation. If I had thought ahead yours would have been a great case study. But writing documentation is slow, we're all unpaid volunteers with lives and jobs, so it will be weeks away

Will be great when it's done. And if you feel inspired you'll be able to contribute and improve it too, as it will be wiki based.