[Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.2.1 2017-08-16

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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby sketch » Mon Jan 13, 2014 11:10 pm

PhantomSoul wrote:The vast majority of subdivision neighborhoods all over NJ still have soft turn rules. Any changes made with JNF automatically harden soft rules at any junctions edited with its Q keystrokes. The result is that when Waze receives conflicting data against a hard rule, it creates an MP, vs with a soft rule it just might change it. Frankly, I think urban and suburban subdivisions are far easier to manage like this.

Well, I mean, the whole point of soft turns is to have a way for the editor to know which junctions haven't been completely edited. Running JNF on all of them obviates the purpose of soft turns entirely.

An MP may alert you to an incorrectly-set turn, but a soft turn can alert you to an incorrectly-set turn without anyone ever having to drive through it.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby bgodette » Mon Jan 13, 2014 4:14 pm

sketch wrote:JNF fixes soft turns. A mass-JNF tool has the potential to harden a lot of incorrect soft turns in areas that haven't yet been edited properly (you'd be surprised—a lot of the Detroit area is still like this). These are areas where turns should remain soft so the merger process can go about enabling more of them, and so editors are alerted to the presence of these areas.
Fair enough. I'm fairly certain merger still works on original nodes, but am unsure about anything we've created in the last 9 months or so, and that just goes back to the old discussion about WME defaults and incomplete work.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby PhantomSoul » Sun Jan 12, 2014 6:47 am

The vast majority of subdivision neighborhoods all over NJ still have soft turn rules. Any changes made with JNF automatically harden soft rules at any junctions edited with its Q keystrokes. The result is that when Waze receives conflicting data against a hard rule, it creates an MP, vs with a soft rule it just might change it. Frankly, I think urban and suburban subdivisions are far easier to manage like this. Used screenwide, however, particularly at the higher (farther out) zoom levels, an editor can easily corrupt large swaths of the map, so we certainly don't want anyone less than R5 - who might be eager just to pick up mass amounts of edits with minimal keystrokes/clicks just to advance in rank - to be able to do this.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby sketch » Sun Jan 12, 2014 5:10 am

bgodette wrote:
PhantomSoul wrote:If so, I hope it's only available to CMs.
??? the only side effects of the currently released version vs what an editor should be doing are:

It will disable U-Turns, which may not be desirable in certain areas. But since there's still no client support, it's not desirable for a driver unfamiliar with the area to have them to begin with. This has been the case since JNF's first release.

It doesn't split one side of a two segment loop/eye.

It doesn't handle parking lot/private stubs that only connect to the main road and nothing else that are one-way and converts them to two-way.

The difference is that it's fair to assume that someone going node-by-node will be checking each node before JNFing it, whereas someone mass-JNFing all nodes in view will almost certainly be doing so without checking each node. (The toolbox mass-JNF tool is available to me, yet I use it very sparingly for this reason.)

JNF fixes soft turns. A mass-JNF tool has the potential to harden a lot of incorrect soft turns in areas that haven't yet been edited properly (you'd be surprised—a lot of the Detroit area is still like this). These are areas where turns should remain soft so the merger process can go about enabling more of them, and so editors are alerted to the presence of these areas.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby doctorkb » Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:51 pm

bgodette wrote:
PhantomSoul wrote:If so, I hope it's only available to CMs. I, for one, would not want anyone not familiar with the side effects and pitfalls of en masse QW editing to be able to do this.

In fact, I would suggest that for any non-AM editor, you shouldn't be able to use JNF at all on any junction that has at least 1 hard-disabled turn on it, while AM's should have to click past a warning. This way it's harder to JNF bomb people's edits.
??? the only side effects of the currently released version vs what an editor should be doing are:

It will disable U-Turns, which may not be desirable in certain areas. But since there's still no client support, it's not desirable for a driver unfamiliar with the area to have them to begin with. This has been the case since JNF's first release.

It doesn't split one side of a two segment loop/eye.

It doesn't handle parking lot/private stubs that only connect to the main road and nothing else that are one-way and converts them to two-way.


I had trouble following this part of the discussion as well, but I do think I figured it out.

Their concern surrounds the manner in which WMET will let you apply JNF fixes to all visible nodes with one keystroke/click -- and that feature should be restricted to CMs. I don't understand it to be a question of JNF's application.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby bgodette » Wed Jan 08, 2014 3:33 pm

PhantomSoul wrote:If so, I hope it's only available to CMs. I, for one, would not want anyone not familiar with the side effects and pitfalls of en masse QW editing to be able to do this.

In fact, I would suggest that for any non-AM editor, you shouldn't be able to use JNF at all on any junction that has at least 1 hard-disabled turn on it, while AM's should have to click past a warning. This way it's harder to JNF bomb people's edits.
??? the only side effects of the currently released version vs what an editor should be doing are:

It will disable U-Turns, which may not be desirable in certain areas. But since there's still no client support, it's not desirable for a driver unfamiliar with the area to have them to begin with. This has been the case since JNF's first release.

It doesn't split one side of a two segment loop/eye.

It doesn't handle parking lot/private stubs that only connect to the main road and nothing else that are one-way and converts them to two-way.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby doctorkb » Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:46 pm

pumrum wrote:
doctorkb wrote:WME Toolbox incorporates the features you're talking about for Rank 5+ editors.


super. i guess i'll just suffer for now :D


I guess -- unless you can make a case to your Champs to have OyyoDams make an exception -- not even sure they'd do that, but that's your only route.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby pumrum » Tue Jan 07, 2014 8:38 pm

doctorkb wrote:WME Toolbox incorporates the features you're talking about for Rank 5+ editors.


super. i guess i'll just suffer for now :D
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby doctorkb » Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:47 pm

WME Toolbox incorporates the features you're talking about for Rank 5+ editors.
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Re: [Script] WME Junction Node Fixer v0.0.7.5 Dec 23 2012

Postby pumrum » Tue Jan 07, 2014 7:46 pm

PhantomSoul wrote:If so, I hope it's only available to CMs. I, for one, would not want anyone not familiar with the side effects and pitfalls of en masse QW editing to be able to do this.

In fact, I would suggest that for any non-AM editor, you shouldn't be able to use JNF at all on any junction that has at least 1 hard-disabled turn on it, while AM's should have to click past a warning. This way it's harder to JNF bomb people's edits.



Agreed for sure. But now that the default action for 'Q' with JNF preserves hard disables, it's much less of a concern. If you were to zoom to an area that has say, 50 RevCons... applying a global 'Q' action would fix the RevCons and preserve all of the hard-disabled turns.
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