[Script] WME Validator 2020.04.12 (PLACES BETA)

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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.0 (BETA) / 20.01.2014

Postby sketch » Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:32 am

SuperDave1426 wrote:I see what you're saying in the rest of the message; however, given the ratio of two-way to one-way streets (and the fact that WME runs opposite of that, requiring you to have to remember to go change the direction after you draw a road), I'm not sure that's a problem.

Someone who's used to it will click on it, see the direction is already two-way, and move on after wondering about it for a minute or two.

I admit that I certainly don't know about where you live, but here on the west coast the vast majority of roads are two-way, not one-way. It seems to me to make a lot more sense to have the editor default to "two-way." (I'm constantly having to deal with roads that should have been two-way, but the person who created them didn't bother to change the direction from the default "one-way" setting.) Failing that, having it be a feature of an extension is nice.

People have their preferences, though. I wouldn't mind it being a clickable option, so long as it's one of the options that will "stick" so that you don't have to keep going back to change it to what you want, if you happen to want the opposite of the default setting.

I totally understand, and I'm not saying it shouldn't be an option, by any means. I'm just saying it shouldn't be enabled by default. It doesn't matter whether there are more two-way than one-way roads, what matters is it's drawn one-way roads exclusively for years, so that's what people are used to. Changing the behavior from normal is what should require extra user intervention, not returning it to normal.

All Validator settings are saved from one session to the next, so barring the occasional major version update, you should only have to turn it on once.

It would be nice to have the extension give a pop-up warning when a new version resets all your settings, btw.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.0 (BETA) / 20.01.2014

Postby sketch » Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:54 am

Oh, that reminds me... I'm not sure how well-settled this is, and I would wait for other US champs to chime in before implementing this, but I believe we're trying to remove any instance of "Greater * Area" from the map.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.0 (BETA) / 20.01.2014

Postby sketch » Tue Jan 21, 2014 8:12 pm

I agree with two-way freeway as a warning, and two-way ramp as a note, for the US.

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:
gizmouf wrote:[b]Street name starting without upper case

There was a US discussion in the last couple of months about whether there are proper places to not have first letter upper case on real streets. I don't remember the thread or the outcome at this time, but this needs examination. Ramps starting with "to" should definitely be an exception for this check, at least in the US.

I agree to this. Ramps starting with "to" should be excluded outright; other roads starting with a lowercase should be considered a "note", I think, rather than a "warning". We decided in that thread that, although it's rare (and we couldn't actually find any examples of it), in the case that there is a street sign that begins with a lower case letter (e.g., "da Gama Rd"), it should be reproduced as it is on the sign. If the sign is in ALL CAPS, then capitalize the first letter.

Alan, what do you think about a note/warning for "Greater * Area"?
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.3 (BETA) / 23.01.2014

Postby sketch » Thu Jan 23, 2014 4:57 pm

Perhaps directional words should be excluded from the city name check...

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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.1 (BETA) / 21.01.2014

Postby sketch » Fri Jan 24, 2014 6:09 pm

berestovskyy wrote:
sketch wrote:Perhaps directional words should be excluded from the city name check...

Please have a look at Might be incorrect city name explained (forum post). This i case #10 Add/remove word. It has a limit: 10 segments. If you would have more than 10 'West Memphis' segments, they would completely disappear from the report.

I'm not sure if we shall add directional words in all languages. I'd rather to lower the limit mentioned above...

I understand. I guess I got the report because I was zoomed pretty far out so it was only grabbing a couple West Memphis freeway segments at the time. Sort of a weird thing, but it's not a big deal.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.8 (BETA) / 31.01.2014

Postby sketch » Sat Feb 01, 2014 8:01 pm

myriades wrote:Hi
Maybe a minor enhancement could be done.
When you select multiple segments, you got something like that.
WME_multiple_seg_sel.png

Maybe you can disable the report when multiple select is performed or at least grouping errors by #type?

That's what I'd like to see: something like "Soft turns on drivable road (12) // Unterminated drivable road (5)" etc.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.9 (BETA) / 02.02.2014

Postby sketch » Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:38 pm

SuperDave1426 wrote:
berestovskyy wrote:If this one-way Ramp has a turn enabled to another one-way Ramp. Here is an example: permalink

I fail to see why that is an "unneeded name," given the length of the ramp. I've seen lots of named segments of that nature out here, and have been doing it that way all along, since it helps to provide guidance to drivers making their way to the freeway.

Because it will automatically take the name of the next named ramp. They have the same name, so there's no need* to name the first one as it'll already give the second one's name as the instruction. It makes zero difference* client-side, so there's no reason* to have the extraneous name taking up space in the Waze database. It's just streamlining.

* I will qualify this by saying that there is actually a reason to name this ramp—if you want the "keep right" command here, but no corresponding command for staying to the left. Because both of these segments are unnamed, the left side of the fork will be considered the "best continuation" and no instruction will be given. On the other hand, if the right side of the fork is left unnamed, there will be no best continuation and an instruction will be given either way.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.10 (BETA) / 03.02.2014

Postby sketch » Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:44 pm

SuperDave1426 wrote:
berestovskyy wrote:03.02.2014 v0.5.10:
- NEW for ALL 'Too short segment' (less than 2m long)


Just a "point of curiosity" question, but how does a segment less than 2 meters in length (which is a bit over 6 feet) cause a problem? I agree, it's kinda pointless to put in a segment that's that short, but I'm wondering why there's a check for it (not opposed; just curious).

We were told just a week or two ago by Waze staff that any segment under 5 meters can cause problems—specifically with the calculation of average times.

So, this check should probably be adjusted to alert for any segment under 6 m long.
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Re: elevation -5 must be used exclusively for railroads

Postby sketch » Mon Feb 03, 2014 5:57 pm

dbraughlr wrote:Why is it wrong for walking trails, boardwalks, and runways to be elevation -5?
I hadn't heard that -5 means railroad. -5 is just a convention that mean do not connect to roadway.

I don't see why a walking trail with elevation -5 is an error. What else should it be?
"Rails to trails" are very popular. Many trails follow old RR rights-of-way.

A useful check is a non-drivable type junctioned with a drivable type.

Some communities have been using Walking Trails at elevation -5 to signify railroads as a matter of editor policy. Remember that a lot of the checks in Validator are not necessarily wrong, they're just things that might need a look.

SuperDave1426 wrote:
sketch wrote:(ramp stuff)
Ok, I see what you're saying there.

Although there are still times where naming individual segments apply (as you mentioned further in your message), so it seems that a check of that type is probably still not a good idea. Both in the case that we're talking about and which you acknowledge, but also times when the name changes to provide directional information.

I.E., an offramp that splits; the split segments have information about what they're taking you to beyond simply the road name that they're connecting you to.

I'll reiterate the point I made, that many of these are just checks. Not everything needs action. Some extraneous nodes are there because of temporary disconnections for closures, for example. There are some cases where the directions are different depending on which side you're coming from, yes. But there are plenty cases where they're the same. It's still worth looking at.

dbraughlr wrote:
sketch wrote:So, this check should probably be adjusted to alert for any segment under [X] m long

... for any drivable segment except a terminal (dead-end) segment under [X] m long ...

Very nice. I agree with this completely.
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Re: [Script] WME Validator 0.5.9 (BETA) / 02.02.2014

Postby sketch » Mon Feb 03, 2014 6:19 pm

dbraughlr wrote:
sketch wrote:there's no reason* to have the extraneous name taking up space in the Waze database. It's just streamlining.

Whether the name takes up space is the database is a matter of how the database is designed. It doesn't affect routing. Regardless, it should not be the rationale driving this change.

Map simplicity is cited as a rationale by people around here pretty often. I don't personally always agree with it—accurate reflection of reality is more important—but I do understand that there is an interest in keeping the data size smaller, thereby reducing the amount of data that needs to be pulled by the client. A small difference, yes, but the kind of thing that adds up if it's taken as a matter of course.

Really, though, I'm not the one to rationalize that. It's not a cause my heart's really in. The example used is the kind of case where I wouldn't remove a ramp name if I came across it.

The better rationalization for this is simplicity in editing. For ramp segments like these, it's a lot easier to deal with if the only one you have to fix the name on is the long one that the two smaller segments lead into. The example shown earlier, on the other hand, may be easier to edit if the name is kept. Here's another example of that.

dbraughlr wrote:
sketch wrote:Remember that a lot of the checks in Validator are not necessarily wrong, they're just things that might need a look.
...
I'll reiterate the point I made, that many of these are just checks. Not everything needs action.


In practice, you are mistaken. There are many editors that expect the Validator to give their area a clean bill of health. Come to chat and talk to them. Editors have been deleting the loops flagged with "Same endpoints drivable segments" error. I recommended installing the updated Validator instead.

Any arbitrary "rules" like this should be turned off by default, clearly marked as informational when turned on, and marked with green or some color never used for errors.

Many editors also landmark Best Buys and Burger Kings, doesn't mean they're right. Instead of disallowing them from landmarking, we should be teaching them not to landmark. Likewise, we should be teaching editors to take much of what they see in Validator with a grain of salt.

But yes, I agree that this particular check should be a "note". Notes are blue, informational, and turned off by default.
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