Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Sun Nov 23, 2014 3:26 am

I am all for sticking with the standard.

MH - 3
mH - 2
PS - 2

Larger cities may need increase to

MH - 4
mH - 3
PS - 2

Fwy - 5
Rmp - 5
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Sun Nov 23, 2014 6:34 am

davielde wrote:Are larger cities more important? Is this because of the potential for more editors where there are more drivers?



Exactly. Larger cities get more tourists and travelers.

Could have larger old editor bases that don't follow standard.

I'm not saying it WILL be needed. But it could be. I'd rather run a higher lock in that city and maybe need a few more unlocks, then have someone break something and me not find it for a while. (Detroit is on my mind in this. I work URs, but rarely have time to pan down at close zoom)
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:07 am

That was a lot of math... :)

As far as highways. I don't see that being something that we can really negotiate.

4 is probably the lowest that we can put them. I had them lowered to 4 in San Diego for a while. But I was on every day and the only active 4 in the area.

If an AM in MI has a need for freeways to be lowered for work, I have no issue lowering areas and leaving them as such. However that editor will be responsible for watching them and anything that goes wrong will be on them. Just as anything that I touch I am responsible for. Freeways are high value roads. Period. Even in rural areas that seem insignificant, that freeway is the only long range routing that Waze servers see. They aren't going to see the roads around it.

I had a case in Canada where Waze physically wouldn't route to a city because the only freeway (only highway type road in/out) had a disabled continuation TR.

There are still a few editors that don't communicate out there. Yes they can be blocked. But who knows how long it would take us to catch an issue.

I am not saying that some of our AM aren't capable of working on the freeways, but it becomes a risk management issue.

Also, in regards to posting unlock/update requests. We have Google Hangouts for EVERYTHING now. The forums are almost a back up. There is no reason you can't send a quick unlock request in a Hangout.

I have my phone all day and am willing to unlock at any time. It may take me 20 minutes or so to get to now that I am working full time again. But there is no excuse to leave something broken when it can be fixed.

My email for Hangouts is: skidooguywaze@gmail

I also agree with David that the Mentor Program is very underutilized. I was one of the first applicants at the beginning of this year from rank 3-4. I learned a lot from it and highly suggest it. And yes, it can lead to rank increases and AM areas/increases.
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Fri Dec 12, 2014 1:24 am

TerryPurdue wrote:
SkiDooGuy wrote:Also, in regards to posting unlock/update requests. We have Google Hangouts for EVERYTHING now. The forums are almost a back up. There is no reason you can't send a quick unlock request in a Hangout.

One concern/complaint I've heard is that the Hangouts (at least the Ohio and GLR ones I'm in) are reserved for AMs only. If we do set a min lock for segments at L3 and the Hangouts are AM-only, that means the very people who need the unlocks are the ones prevented from (easily) broadcasting their request to the group.

At one point I an SM and I discussed the possibility of starting up an Ohio Hangout for all editors, AM or not, thus letting the full gang reap the (amazing!) benefits of the Hangouts.

As far as I know, nothing's come of that, but I may be operating on old data. :)

-Terry


Oh, we kinda broke that rule. All reasonably active editors are in the MI AM Hangout. There is only half a dozen of us anyway. Anyone who sticks around for a few is invited. I have editors send me PM's all the time as well, which although a little slower, does the same thing.
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Fri Dec 12, 2014 3:01 am

trukkurt wrote:
Would be nice to use a script to get a quick view of segments which have been edited recently (using script-user-specified number of days) and that would help me keep an eye on changes and also to see whether road types may have been downgraded from FC (in the unlikely event a R2+ editor does that).




WMECH - Color Highlights has a section called "Advanced Features" that is available to AM's and allows you to highlight bright green any segments that have been edited within the amount of days you select.
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Fri Dec 12, 2014 11:32 pm

trukkurt wrote:Thanks. I wonder if we can get the author of that WMECH script to remove the R3/AM restriction, or at least lower it to 2. I don't understand why it's locked at R3/AM.

By the way, my vote for road lock standards is now modified a little after some thought.

Ramp road types lock at 4+ if they involve complicated freeway interchanges (i.e., ramp to ramp wayfinders).

Ramp road types for Michigan Lefts or simple exit/entrance ramps lock at 2 for editors like me. :)


It has other features that could be more privacy invasive. Any script that can track usernames is usually locked a bit.

Stop being lazy and just get AM!!

MI lefts usually have in depth names that take time to get right. And as you know there is an editor in your area who kinda does what he wants with them anyway. Better to keep the ones we have correct safe.
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Tue Jan 13, 2015 3:08 am

Well this is going the way lock standards threads always go.... Circles!

I am a fan of the following after this thread:

Fwy-5
Ramp-5 (or Highest. MUTI always 5)
MH-3
mH-3
PS-2

Places I agree with the general standard with one exception. I personally prefer to lock COMPLETE (key word here) at 3 to stop IGN from running amok. But as this is a GLR Road Lock thread; places can wait for another.

With no complaints I would like to start implementing these in Michigan. I already have a few editors pushing to start.
We will always have special circumstances, but I feel 3 is more than adequete for MH. Anything more and we are tying the hands of the few editors we have in MI.

Ohio has too many active editors. You guys have no input here! 8-)
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby SkiDooGuy » Wed Jan 28, 2015 2:56 am

Lonewolf147 wrote:
GizmoGuy411 wrote:As many of you may know, I have recommended for some time that one way streets be locked to L2 and Primary Streets to L3, ONLY after their direction has been adequately researched. Therefore any unresearched one-way ST or PS should be at L1.

Of course any locking action should imply that the segment is correct.



GG, I remember Waze used to auto change one way streets if someone drove them the wrong way. Does this still happen, or does locking them prevent this?


No, this behavior was done away with a while ago.

The only way street direction can be manipulated is if it is an untouched road by editors, such as basemap. Then cars should still be able to manipulate it.
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby TerryPurdue » Wed Dec 03, 2014 6:17 am

anti-S-crap wrote:I think MH and mh should be kept at 3. There are so many more MH and mh now that the NFC classification has started.

Having done a fair bit of FC work in SW Ohio, this argument is a big part of why I'm a fan of:

5 (4) / 3 / 3 / 2 -- Translation: Freeway (freeway ramp) / MH / mH / PS.

The other angle to this discussion is a perception issue in my opinion: when you're talking about R3 editors, you are (at least a large percentage of the time) talking about Area Managers.

If we can't trust Area Managers to fully understand and appreciate the importance of MH roads in the areas they're managing, I feel like the whole belief system we're working off of is broken.

Personally, I would encourage a system that allows all Area Managers to edit all segments in their areas save for freeways and freeway ramps.

-Terry
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Re: Great Lakes Road Lock Standards

Postby TerryPurdue » Fri Dec 12, 2014 12:09 am

This conversation seems to have stalled out a bit, so I thought I'd take a quick look at where we are to see if we've got consensus yet.

Tallied the votes as follows (please double-check to make sure I understood all post(s) and wrote down the data correctly, as well as didn't accidentally miss anyone):

Legend: PS / mH / MH / Fwy / Fwy Ramp

  • SkiDooGuy: 2 / 2 / 3 / 5 / 5
  • Helgramite: 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 / 5
  • davielde: 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 / 5
  • jdeyoung: 2 / 3 / 4 / 5 / 5
  • anti-s-crap: 2 / 3 / 3 / 5 / 5
  • hawkeygoal: 1 / 2 / 3 / 5 / 5
  • miked_64: 1 / 2 / 3 / 5 / 5
  • TerryPurdue: 2 / 3 / 3 / 5 / 4
  • Gazoo4U: 2 / 2 / 2 / 5 / 3
Assuming that data's right, here's what falls out stats-wise:

  • PS
    • Mean: 1.78
    • Std Dev: 0.44
  • mH
    • Mean: 2.56
    • Std Dev: 0.56
  • MH
    • Mean: 3.22
    • Std Dev: 0.67
  • Freeway
    • Mean: 5.00
    • Std Dev: 0.00
  • Freeway Ramp
    • Mean: 4.67
    • Std Dev: 0.71
My personal read of that data (disclaimer: I am not a statistician, and that is a very small sample size):

  • Early indications:
    • PS: 2
    • mH: 2/3 (very borderline)
    • MH: 3
    • Freeway: 5
    • Freeway Ramp: 5
  • There seems to be little disagreement about freeways at 5, there is a small difference of opinion about correct level for PS and mH, and a bit more (but not huge) difference on MH and Freeway Ramps.
So... thoughts?

-Terry
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