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Modifying the lock option (and some explanations)

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EDIT (Nov. 28th 2011) - this change has now gone live on both US and WORLD editors. See details below the dashed line.

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Hi guys,

Thanks to Shorty-CM and other wazers who sent us great feedback, we discovered a bug in the way our nodes and turn restrictions behave.
Basically, today you can have a situation where there's no connectivity (in cartouche) / you see a red arrow (in papyrus), but the routing will still route you through the turn.

This is happening because the turn was never set as 'restricted' (though it was never set as 'allowed' either). If it was never set as 'restricted', and waze routing server has no other information that indicates it is not allowed, it might choose to go through this turn, even though it isn't marked as allowed (in papyrus / cartouche).

As more and more people ignore this turn, waze will eventually learn that it is indeed not allowed. But in the meantime, wazers might get a wrong turn maneuver - and this is where this fix comes in handy.

To fix such a situation, we are tweaking the lock mechanism, as follows (all information relevant for Papyrus only, see below for cartouche):
* When you edit allowed / restricted turns for a specific segment, you are locking the turns for that intersection.
editing_just_turns.jpg
* If no turns are edited, the system will treat it as described above. That means, a user who makes the turn will open the turn to be 'allowed'. Once you edit at least one turn restriction on the node, it means all turns for that segment on that node will be locked.
* When you lock a segment, you are locking the turns on both ends of the segment. This is a bit tricky - especially for long segments - as you have to make sure you checked the turns on both ends of the segment.
locking_the_segment_turns.jpg
* Permissions-wise, locking will still lock the segment from being edited by another user who has a lower rank than yours. At this time, we're not going to lock the editing of turns (as we do with the segment), so even if the segment is locked, other users can change the turn restrictions.
* Driving direction of the segment is also locked (as before) from being changed by the analysis of drives.
* The segment's geometry is protected from being changed by the analysis of drives.

So, to sum up:
When you edit (even w/o locking) a driving direction or a turn restriction in the Papyrus you guarantee two things:
1. The routes analyzer (merger) will treat this driving direction as the true direction, and will not open it again (even if a person with a scooter, for example, drove the wrong way in a one-way street).
2. Our routing will treat this driving direction as the true one, i.e. will give a higher penalty for driving against the direction [28/11/2011 -This is still being developed, and will be implemented soon]


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In the cartouche:
* We are more limited on the cartouche. When you edit a restricted turn, you are actually locking the entire node. We realize usually you work on all turns in a junction, but this is something you should be aware of if you're still working with the cartouche and not papyrus.

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Note - Nov. 7th - the fix is not uploaded yet to the Papyrus. On the cartouche, it is already working as described above.
We will update you once uploaded and operational - should be in the next couple of days.


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Finally, a short note about locking your segments as 'protection'.
Locking your segment guarantees that a user with a lower rank will not be able to edit your segment based on his 'drive-by' permissions. However, a user who's an area manager, will be able to edit any segment within his area, even if it is locked.

POSTER_ID:84

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Post by AlanOfTheBerg
Krankyd, one more follow-up: does this in any way affect the previously communicated state of basemap nodes/segments which show no allowed turns, but in fact are all allowed until an editor makes an adjustment? Do we still need to restrict ALL turns first before setting any allowed turns in order to disable all turns? This is how we've been operating for several months now.
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Post by AlanOfTheBerg
I agree the junctions should be there. Even though this is a signed Exit though, it doesn't fit the documented requirement of ramp type being for graded use only. Though I struggle with thinking it should just be a street type of "ramp" because then it looks silly.

Honestly, in similar areas, I have and would recommend making the exit a major highway type just like the road it runs in to. The verbal prompts for Exit right should still work. It would make the whole interchange look more cohesive, too.

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Post by AlanOfTheBerg
The Papyrus version hasn't changed, but it appears this may be working. Hard to say though, because it takes time to find out that the unlock didn't take. Just reloading from the permalink usually shows the lock state changed, but that isn't always reliable.
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Post by AlanOfTheBerg
dmcconachie wrote:I'm pretty sure we were told that wasn't a problem as the routing server would use the 1way road over any turn non-restriction and is the exact reason they don't thus show in papyrus. I've not experienced any time when I've been routed the wrong way up a 1way street!
When parking lot roads are involved, I have been routed the wrong way on 1-way segments often. However, turn restrictions would not have an effect here.
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Post by asterix06
Thanks Dror !
Good question Alan !
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Post by bgodette
Shorty-CM wrote:Something's not quite right with that explanation, because the intersection I used as an example in my latest email is actually one that we've had quite a few problems/bugs crop up with over the course of time that I've been using Waze and both someone from the Waze staff and I have edited this intersection many times during those investigations. I know 100% for sure that I personally edited the turn permissions myself last because I wasn't happy with how it was last edited and changed by the Waze staff, and quite some time ago now, (May of last year?) and only recently has it started ignoring turn restrictions there again and routing me against those restrictions.

https://www.waze.com/cartouche_old/?zoo ... 1=59433578

This intersection most definitely had its restrictions set manually by me for every single direction. But it has tried making me turn left from that segment. And has tried making me turn right from this segment:

https://www.waze.com/cartouche_old/?zoo ... 1=59613739

There are no turns allowed through that intersection from any direction, but Waze has ignored the restrictions lately. Anyways, just to make sure, I removed and reset all restrictions here again just now.
Why are there even junctions there in the first place if you're not allowed to make any turns at those two junctions?
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Post by bgodette
Shorty-CM wrote:Because it is a controlled intersection.
So? All that's done is given an opportunity to overwhelm the turn restrictions, and added supposedly an additional 10s of route time. Without the junctions no such opportunity exists and the average speed over that non-grade-changing ramp would be just fine and account for the stop light delay.

I'd remove those junctions, fix levels, and be done with it, you can't turn so there's no point in them being there.

/well ok, emergency vehicles can and probably do make turns there, but still.
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Post by bgodette
Shorty-CM wrote:And then every single time the light goes red there is going to be a traffic warning triggered.
If they don't now, they won't if they're removed.
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Post by bgodette
Shorty-CM wrote:Search the forums for 'slowest 50 meters' and you'll find several instances, such as this from The Fej.

http://www.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php ... ers#p12741

I didn't just join the Waze community yesterday. ;) So, yes, junctions are important.
gettingthere wrote:
Shorty-CM wrote:How is it I'm the only one that knows about a segment's slowest 50m at junctions?
Source?
Interesting, and is something that really needs to be in the wiki as it gives a strong argument for placing junctions on at-grade railroad crossings. Given this information I'd place 3 junctions, one on each stop line, and raise the level of the crossing segment. Eliminates the issue regardless of any problems with route weighting.
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Post by bgodette
jasonh300 wrote:
Shorty-CM wrote:Go crazy with 'allow all directions' along big, long stretches of highway. For, like, 4 hours, and then cry as you notice this now means that the whole thing allows driving the wrong way. And then spend another 4 hours fixing it in cartouche. Heh. Where 'allow all' works with 1-ways. For one example.
I'm not following...How does "allow all" not work with one-ways in Papyrus?
Using "allow all" (W) in Papyrus causes reverse connectivity onto one-way and no-entrance roads. It's probably not a good thing as turn restrictions and routing against one-way are two different costs.
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