[New Page] Places/Airport

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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Tue May 09, 2017 1:43 pm

I added the caveat about military airfields and more alt name examples.
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Tue May 09, 2017 6:20 pm

Yes, I agree that the question of boundary needs to be resolved, and I concur that mapping to the fenceline is best. I'm not sure how including airport tenant businesses in the airport area is a downside.
Airport draft page wrote:Each airport should be drawn as a single area place, covering all the airport property and including any runways, taxiways, terminal buildings, control towers or other structures. This will ensure visibility on the map.

That's what's on the page now. Are you suggesting it be expanded to something like this?
Each airport should be drawn as a single area place, covering all the airport property to the fenceline and including any runways, taxiways, terminal buildings, control towers or other structures. This will ensure visibility on the map.
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Mon May 15, 2017 5:17 pm

kentsmith9 wrote:I was just thinking it might be good to add one more section at the end. (I have not yet added it.)

I added your section; changed the words a tiny bit.

Any other changes to be made?
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Mon May 15, 2017 7:29 pm

Done!
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Wed May 17, 2017 11:26 am

I had wondered about maxing out on links. As long as the places have correct info and location, the only downside I see is that there would be two of them in the search, but we live with duplicates from Google in searches anyway.
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Wed May 17, 2017 11:30 am

Seems like any distinction would only cause confusion, unless there are different entrances or something. If both places get you to the rental car center, and they're both in the same spot, they should just be the same. Then users don't have to wonder "what if rental car center 2 is the wrong one???"
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Wed May 17, 2017 11:45 am

Maybe you could drop a map comment there too in case any well-meaning editor tries to "fix it." :) I agree that we should update the page with info about this situation.
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Thu May 25, 2017 10:10 pm

I'm a fan of Hertz - MSY for a single location. No need to write more than that. If two locations I like Hertz rental counter - MSY and Hertz car return - MSY.

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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Thu Jun 15, 2017 12:28 pm

Concision is good, but one word won't make much of a difference with this, since the name will be fully visible in search. It also seems good to be consistent with title case (except when putting parenthetical information in, which is more of a description stuck in the name for visibility). So for this I think using Rental Car Counter and Rental Car Return in the names for separate rental & return places is fine. I do think it would be good to have consistency on using hyphens with places that start with the airport code, whether terminals or car rental facilities. I favor not having a hyphen in there, as shown in the current section on terminals.
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Re: [New Page] Places/Airport

Postby Kartografer » Thu Oct 05, 2017 1:11 pm

sketch wrote:
kentsmith9 wrote:I believe this group of paragraphs is the same thought, which I believe is that for locations with separate Counters and Returns, you propose that the counter be named the short "Avis - DEN" matching the same name given for the Single location types as in:
  • Single location for counter and return
    • Avis - DEN
  • Split locations for counter and return
    • Avis - DEN
    • Avis rental car return - DEN

Where I am proposing we differentiate the name for single locations vs separate locations with:
  • Single location for counter and return
    • Avis - DEN
  • Split locations for counter and return
    • Avis rental car counter - DEN
    • Avis rental car return - DEN

I think the second way is better for people searching because with the split locations, your example does not clarify the counter location is not a car return. If I had previously seen an entry for "Avis - IAD" I know from experience that has the car return. Now with a split location, the name does not clarify there is NOT a car return under that same name. I think that will cause more confusion than if we clarify when a location is not both functions.

I can support this.

kentsmith9 wrote:Also, the naming to me is too long and similar in the above second example. I had originally proposed using slightly different terminology to help differentiate the two names with

  • Split locations for counter and return
    • Avis rental counter - DEN
    • Avis car return - DEN

I would prefer this, yes. At least with "rental counter". I am on the fence about "car return".

On one hand, "car return" is concise and descriptive, and would make sense if you search "avis" or "avis den". On the other hand, if you search "den rental car return", it would be beneficial to see both the generic facility and all the rental brand options presented in the results, and I imagine removing "rental" from the name would make that less likely.

kentsmith9 wrote:LOL. I didn't recognize that you were proposing the title case was only under the condition that "Rental Car Return" was used as the main place name and when part of the rental agency as in "Avis rental car return" it is sentence case.

While I can see the logic, I'm not sure it makes any different to me visually in the search results. I would prefer to keep it consistent since a "Avis Rental Car Return" is a place too, but if we can get some additional support to make the guidance as follows I will add it as such:
  • Avis rental car return - use sentence case when lead by the rental agency.
  • DEN - Rental Car Return - use title case when lead by the airport code without an agency.

I do think this looks better and makes the results easier to read. Say we eliminate the hyphen (as Kartografer recommends below, and I am okay with this), which list makes it more obvious which one stands out?
  • Avis Rental Car Return - DEN
  • DEN Rental Car Return
  • Alamo Rental Car Return - DEN
  • Dollar Rental Car Return - DEN
  • Avis rental car return - DEN
  • DEN Rental Car Return
  • Alamo rental car return - DEN
  • Dollar rental car return - DEN
And I just think it looks better too.

Kartografer wrote:Concision is good, but one word won't make much of a difference with this, since the name will be fully visible in search. It also seems good to be consistent with title case (except when putting parenthetical information in, which is more of a description stuck in the name for visibility). So for this I think using Rental Car Counter and Rental Car Return in the names for separate rental & return places is fine. I do think it would be good to have consistency on using hyphens with places that start with the airport code, whether terminals or car rental facilities. I favor not having a hyphen in there, as shown in the current section on terminals.

My problem with "Rental Car Counter" and "Rental Car Return" is not that they're too long, but that they're too similar. Kent mentioned this above. I would much prefer to see "Avis rental counter" and either "Avis car return" or "Avis rental car return". You're searching for "Avis" in this case.

On the other hand, when you are searching for a general facility, it is important to have the words "rental car" in the name because that's what you'll search for: "msy rental car" or something of that nature. This is why I would propose "Avis rental counter" but "DEN Rental Car Counter".

As for hyphens, I am in favor of removing them where the abbreviation is first in the name.

I think we got close to a consensus on this but then stopped. I think we should get this update into the Airport page. So based on what has been said, how about adding Kent's draft with the following modifications:
    No hyphens where the airport code is first, so "IAD Rental Car Facility" and "KAE Rental Car Return
    Sentence case and "rental counter" or "rental car return" where the company name is first, so "Hertz rental counter - JFK" and "National rental car return - DEN"
Does this work? I almost just put just car return but then saw sketch's point about how that may exclude places in some searches
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