Post by JamesKingdom
iangpowell wrote: Mon Jan 30, 2023 5:51 pm But on the flip side, and this is just me playing devil's advocate, you could argue that all motorists should be travelling at an appropriate speed and be able to stop in the distance they can see is safe, being able to react and respond to signage or road markings that suggests a junction priority is against them.

Don't get me wrong, I too get equally as frustrated by the constant URs related to rural crossroads, however it should surely also be considered that the more we ask Waze to be vocal and get involved, the more we are potentially distracting the road user from the act of being in control of their vehicle and being responsible for their actions on the road rather than being reliant on technology to carry out the driving for them.

 
But then at the same time shouldn't drivers be able to navigate with road signs and not rely on GPS to get to their destination? Bit of an extreme example but yeah there are infinite arguments here I feel like  :(
 
 
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Post by jonv-uk
Waze is there to tell the driver what route to take. Turn left, Take the second exit, Keep right, Use the left two lanes etc are all directions to follow, not instructions of how to drive the route.
If we start adding Continue instructions at crossroads drivers will come to expect to hear it, leaving Waze potentially at blame for not telling drivers at junctions that haven't been mapped yet. We'd have to map every crossroads for consistency.

It's not Waze's job to tell a driver how to drive, should we also map alerts for
Traffic lights & pedestrian Crossings? (Traffic light junction ahead, prepare to stop if the light is red)
Zebra Crossings? (pedestrian crossing ahead, look out for pedestrians waiting to cross)
Corners with advisory speed reductions? (Sharp corner ahead, prepare to slow down)
Cycle paths (Turn left onto Main St, caution cycle lane crossing junction, prepare to give way to cyclist)
How far do we go?


 
 
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Post by jonv-uk
titchy_ wrote: Fri Feb 03, 2023 9:48 am Sooner or later this will end up with an accident Waze will get blamed for.





 
I think Waze have themselves covered in the Terms of Use every user agreed to when installing the app.

"...Road information prevails. The information provided by the Service is not intended to replace the information provided on the road, such as travel direction, time based restrictions, lane restrictions, road blockades, traffic signs, traffic lights, police instructions, etc.
Cautious driving. Always drive vigilantly according to road conditions and in accordance with traffic laws...."

"...ALWAYS DRIVE VIGILANTLY ACCORDING TO ROAD CONDITIONS AND IN ACCORDANCE WITH TRAFFIC LAWS...."


Waze Privacy & Terms
 
 
 
 
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Post by jonv-uk
With Waze being a global app, whatever solution we suggest to the developers needs to work in other countries too. Any English voice alert would need to be meaningful in many countries with differing standards of junctions.

If we had a 'Caution' alert, similar to the Level Crossing alert, that can be mapped in WME. Users can then enable/disable this alert in the Report menu on the app, alongside Level Crossing, Red Light Camera, Hazards on Road etc
 
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Post by Kevintiobraid
I guess I've given my two pence numerous times over the years, so I'll keep it short:
- I'd agree with having continue instructions at certain junctions.  I also find the constant URs tiring, but I've kind of given up now.
- The argument that Waze would give too much information works the other way as well.  e.g. if we don't give straight on instructions at a crossroads, then why do we give straight on / 2nd exit instructions at standard roundabouts?
- The French have, in my opinion, sensible guidelines on how to map these junctions.  Section 3.3.5 here: https://wazeopedia.waze.com/wiki/France ... ctions_TIO
Google translated:
The intersections of major roads in the countryside are potentially dangerous. In order to warn of the approach of such an intersection, the instruction "Continue straight" is added on the road having a stop sign or give way.
The following three conditions must be met to apply this rule:

Roads of type "Primary street" or more
Roads outside built-up areas
Presence of a stop sign or a give way sign


My area:
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=19083205
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=19074849
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18915420
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=19050184
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18970261
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18990710
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18988177
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18959993
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=19058553
https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... t=18921496
 
 
 
 
 
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Post by Kevintiobraid
Waze already does get the blame: 
https://www.waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=r ... t=18990710
Or here a couple of years ago where someone did claim to actually have a crash: https://waze.com/en-GB/editor?env=row&l ... =122661345
Anyway, I'd better get on and reply to all those URs I linked to on Page 1.  Should I apologise to them for poor navigation instructions, or tell them they're silly for not looking out the windscreen  :?:  :mrgreen:
 
 
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Post by MrSoapsud
A few thoughts on this from an AM with a mainly rural area. 
I don't recall seeing many URs like these - the one I've seen more of is imagining No Entry signs on lanes with only double-dashed lines across the ends.
I have been a pilot and the priority recommendation for flyers is "Aviate, Navigate, Communicate" - i.e. your first priority is flying the plane which (unless you're in cloud!) requires looking out of the window. As long as you're doing that ok, you can then worry about where you're going. Beyond that you can allocate some brain cycles to talking to air traffic control or your passenger or whoever. I would say the equivalent in Waze terms, which I think is what the T's&C's say is that your first priority is to drive the car in accordance with the road signs and conditions. I'm genuinely surprised at the number of URs you guys have highlighted though which suggest that some users have different expectations - most have very clear Give Way signs although I accept a few didn't. 
As an AM though, I'd be concerned about having to look at every junction across my area (most of Wales) and apply the appropriate setting to whichever bits of the junction, on the understanding that failing to do so might lead to Waze and/or me being held responsible for an accident caused by someone ignoring road signs. I would think if we go down that road (pun intended!) there will then be other things that our users expect from the app. Should we tell drivers when to slow down for bends over a certain angle etc.?
As for the French example, I didn't look in detail at what whoever referred to but the situation in France is different for historical reasons. You always had to be careful approaching junctions in France due to "priorité à droite" - you had to give way to vehicles from the right which you might not be able to see until the last minute. This even used to apply to vehicles joining main roads although I think that got altered some time ago. 
Probably an incoherent ramble which doesn't add to the debate - my wife says I often need to say something for the sake of it... 
Regards
Martin
 
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Post by PropertyGeek
Personally I feel it should be a voice command as I think Waze does have a duty also to warn of issues which might be a hazard.

After all Waze will inform you of many things, it does seem odd that potential dangers are ignored such as junctions which can be hidden until you are almost on top of them.

But not everyone agrees.
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Post by PropertyGeek
I guess if we are not going to add instructions to purely help people, why include speed cameras as these should not be required based on some arguments.

After all if people speed then who are we to warn them of a potential fine or points on their licence. 

Same might apply to lane guidance. 

Once you have driven down roads that are single track, a warning of a junction would at times be very welcome - just to know that the endless stress will soon be at the end. 😂 
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Post by thepeganator
This conversation seems pretty much decided between senior people already, but my 2 cents.

I've reported this junction here for exactly this issue, you come around a corner at 40mph, to have no signage and be met with a give way on the road. In the dark and the wet you might not even see it as you go past it.

By the letter of what Waze is designed for you you need to mark it? No of course not, but then you can change that to say whatever you like and decide what Waze is for and not for.
Waze is meant to help people, and potentially keep them safer by giving them extra information about their drive, this would really help this is situations like this.

There is lots of talk about users "glued to their screen", but this is coming from people who have put potentially thousands of hours into improving this service for them, we obviously already want to help them, why not do this too?

I for one hate voice navigation, and use Waze because of how clear and easy to see the non voice guidance is. Voice or no voice this would be a useful feature, one that users would get value out of, and one that would keep people safer.
The French have already decided and worked out that it is possible, so there's no restriction on being able to do it.

Based on that, why would we not do it?
Why would we on purposefully do less than other countries?
Because someone doesn't want to do the work?
Speed limit introduction a few years before me showed that this volume of work is more than possible, and this would be way smaller than that.

To me, I'm yet to see any justification on why this wouldn't be implemented, but I'm only 99% of the time a user, and have no input on those who make the decision if those have already been made (:.

 
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