Roundabout flags disapearing

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Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby davipt » Thu Oct 25, 2012 10:12 am

Hello all,

I've discovered several roundabouts that simply stoped being roundabouts sometime in the recent mapdate past. I'm certain I've created tham as roundabouts several months ago, and I couldn't see any change since then, but some days ago when I crossed them and saw the wrong instructions then at home noticed they are no longer marked as roundabout, according to the WME Ext. Tools segment-list flags list.

Unfortunately I've already fixed them up, but I still wonder what could cause that flag to be lost in a mapupdate. I can send some permalinks if needed, but I'm just wondering if anyone noticed something similar.

Now I've double checked they are locked, all arrows green (q+w in all), no u-turns, no nothing strange, so I hope it doesn't happen again. I can only guess waze stuggles with too large roundabouts, or too oval ones, because the regular round and relatively small ones all seem to be ok.

This is quite painful because even though I've been double checking all roundabouts, locking them, setting all arrows to green, every other mapdate something goes wrong with them. Tipically one of the entries gives the wrong instructions ("at the roundabout ..." and then nothing), but these cases now where the roundabout flag simply goes away is scaring me.

Here's some examples, unfortunately already fixed:

Oval ones:
https://world.waze.com/editor/#?zoom=5& ... ,179153198
https://world.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&l ... ,179153494

Large major-highway junction ones:
https://world.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&l ... ,179441145
https://world.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&l ... ,179476964
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Thu Oct 25, 2012 7:33 pm

"Roundabout" and "Normal" were two segment "types" that Waze quoted to us when we were discussing the failure of the mass unlock to actually unlock everything. There was, apparently, another type which was missed in the original mass unlock, so they ran it again, within the last couple of weeks. It may be a leap to suggest that this unlock also had another unintended consequence for some roundabouts, perhaps if they were the other type, which Waze stated, "was old and we don't know what it is for," they got un-roundabouted?

That's really a stretch, but is the only correlation I could come up with with recent activity/database updates that you wouldn't see in the GUI.
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby davipt » Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:21 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:"Roundabout" and "Normal" were two segment "types" that Waze quoted to us when we were discussing the failure of the mass unlock to actually unlock everything. There was, apparently, another type which was missed in the original mass unlock, so they ran it again, within the last couple of weeks. It may be a leap to suggest that this unlock also had another unintended consequence for some roundabouts, perhaps if they were the other type, which Waze stated, "was old and we don't know what it is for," they got un-roundabouted?

That's really a stretch, but is the only correlation I could come up with with recent activity/database updates that you wouldn't see in the GUI.


I've found another broken one I haven't yet fixed (in terms of segment position and junctions), but unfortunately have updated the name of the whole avenue three days ago roundabout livemap route

I think something went wrong on the last weeks, specially some three days after the last mapdate, where stuff that got fixed on the update got screwed again after those days. things like "keep right/left" instructions even with small angles livemap example of keep right that was fixed, these roundabouts, and now that I've patched the colour script extension to show me all soft-turns and u-turn segments on the map and I see not only that *a lot* of them are u-turn (linked to self if I understand), but worse, a lot of them are segments recently "fixed" by me and hence surely did the q-w-adjust-arrows dance on all the junctions. I'm scared of the result of the update hopefully this night or tomorrow (we're now stable at one update per month!)
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:26 pm

davipt wrote:I've found another broken one I haven't yet fixed (in terms of segment position and junctions), but unfortunately have updated the name of the whole avenue three days ago roundabout livemap route

That certainly doesn't look like a real roundabout.
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Thu Oct 25, 2012 11:27 pm

This roundabout hasn't been touched since Oct-2 and still looks fine.

And this one was updated last in September and looks good today.

I'm not sure what's up...
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby jondrush » Fri Oct 26, 2012 12:52 am

Conversely, is there a way to force roundabouts to no longer be roundabouts? Sometimes the fastest way to draw a roughly circular or oval road would be to start with a roundabout. But I don't want to screw up the TTS.
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby davipt » Fri Oct 26, 2012 7:51 am

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:This roundabout hasn't been touched since Oct-2 and still looks fine.

And this one was updated last in September and looks good today.

I'm not sure what's up...


They are both round!

The first one has been deleted and rebuilt from scratch after the last update (*) and is indeed fine so far, let's see what happens after the next update.

The second one has been deleted and rebuilt *before* the last update (I assume, never understood if the update included changes until 25th 00:00 GMT or 23:59 GMT), and already has a reverse connectivity issue on the top right segment node of the roundabout, which usually means that when arriving at that roundabout from one of the sides (which I might go there today just to test it) waze will tell me "at the roundabout..." and never say the "take the nth exit".

We can't be rebuilding all roundabouts every update :(

(*) I've been trying to rebuild every roundabout to have just the main segments directly connected and avoid having additionally one for entry and one for leaving, like a triangle, as that doubles the number of junctions (and hence doubles the chance of having a screwed junction and dead roundabout) but newbies still tend to draw exactly as seen on the satellite maps, so now I need to lock them all up. It also has the advantage that now it tells me "at the roundabout straight ahead" or "turn right/left" as these are really crosses with a circle in the middle. Yes we've been using the european money since the 90's to rebuild hundreds of roundabouts. We even have a roundabout inside a roundabout! ;) [https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=231718013622228&set=a.231135133680516.52622.216652921795404&type=1]Double roundabout in lisbon[/url]
Last edited by davipt on Fri Oct 26, 2012 8:03 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby davipt » Fri Oct 26, 2012 7:57 am

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:
davipt wrote:I've found another broken one I haven't yet fixed (in terms of segment position and junctions), but unfortunately have updated the name of the whole avenue three days ago roundabout livemap route

That certainly doesn't look like a real roundabout.


We have a lot of those oval and weird ones over here. So I need to create a round one and then pull it oval manually, dot by dot. One thing I've noticed is that after a update the number of dots decrease a lot and it becomes like this one, not as round as initially, but so far after one year had never noticed a roundabout stoping being one.

Any advice on how to do oval ones that are not horizontal or vertical?
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby davipt » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:11 pm

Continuing on this subject, I really think I'm doing something quite wrong or the server is doing something quite wrong, and either way I'm having a bad feeling that roundabouts sucks big time.

Not only I've discovered some roundabouts that stopped being flagged as one, as I'm now discovering a lot other roundabouts that kind of have the directions inverted. What I mean is that when one creates a new roundabout, the edit pane shows "one way ->" and "level 0". The roundabouts in question are still showing the arrows correctly, counter-clockwise, but the edit pane shows nothing, and if I manually select the "one way ->", some of the segments become clockwise. Some of those roundabouts, like the ones that lost the roundabout flat, have been locked for several months, so I really wonder how can we lock a roundabout in such a way that it never ever become screwed again besides redrawing new roundabouts (thousands) every other week.

Please help, any information or opinion could help, this is becoming really frustrating. We have too many roundabouts in Portugal. I think the politicians receive bonus for each new roundabout they build ;)
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Re: Roundabout flags disapearing

Postby thefatveganchef » Mon Oct 29, 2012 9:22 pm

On those roundabouts, I am not seeing the center node. Are you deleting them?
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