Un-named segments for better navigation

The place to get information and ask questions about everything to do with properly and successfully editing the Waze Map.

Use this forum for all general editing questions, and the sub-forums for specific types of Waze Map Editor features.

Moderators: Unholy, bextein

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 3:41 pm

Something I just thought about. When you create a short segment just before an exit, Waze will lose the ability to distinguish traffic jams that might be exiting one direction and not the other through the actual split beyond this short unnamed segment. All traffic data will be mixed in the unnamed segment and Waze will erroneously route traffic around this area when in fact the other direction is not blocked at all. Or Waze will see 90% of traffic going left at full speed and not notice the 10% of traffic completely stopped going right.
USA: Now Idaho; previously California (Northern, SF/SJ)

[ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ]
PLEASE READ: Waze Map Editor (Start Here) | Editing Quick-start | Best Practices | Junctions
kentsmith9
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 5681
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:33 pm
Location: Boise ID and SF/SJ Bay Area of Northern California
Has thanked: 1574 times
Been thanked: 1786 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Mon Apr 22, 2013 5:11 pm

I've never fully understood how the short segments affect the directional times. It would seem to me that the same problem would occur in distinguishing left turns from straight through movements at a split road. Yet it seems that there are conflicting statements regarding whether waze does in fact distinguish left turns from straight movements when both proceed to the cross segment after waiting for the traffic signal.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Atlantic, US
Verizon, Nexus 6, Android 6.0.1, Waze 4.7.0.902
CBenson
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
 
Posts: 10330
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 1055 times
Been thanked: 2353 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:31 pm

SegmentTraffic1.png
(14.89 KiB) Downloaded 722 times

Waze separately computes the travel time of:
* Seg4 > Jnct2 > Seg5
* Seg4 > Jnct2 > Seg6

Therefore any traffic building up on Seg4 that turns right to Seg6 will not affect the route timing for the traffic also using Seg4, but instead turning left to Seg5.

The point I was making earlier is given this segment time tracking, if we add short segments like Seg8 between Seg7 and Jnct4, only Seg8 will know the ultimate destination of the traffic to the left (Seg9) or right (Seg10). So if the traffic backs up longer than the length of Seg8 and reaches Seg7, then the average transit time for Seg7 has only a single number from Seg7 > Jnct3 > Seg8. So the backup getting to Seg10 will cause the through traffic from Seg7 to show a decline in average speed and it may try to find an alternate route.

[Edit: this was added to the Wiki under "Segment exit times" and "Turn delays" so far]
USA: Now Idaho; previously California (Northern, SF/SJ)

[ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ]
PLEASE READ: Waze Map Editor (Start Here) | Editing Quick-start | Best Practices | Junctions
kentsmith9
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 5681
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:33 pm
Location: Boise ID and SF/SJ Bay Area of Northern California
Has thanked: 1574 times
Been thanked: 1786 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby orbitc » Mon Apr 22, 2013 6:48 pm

What happens if instead of adding that short segment, split seg 7? This way you will retain all the data and you can still make it an unnamed road (seg 8).
Regional Coordinator for Northeast & New England
•Tier1 •USA Coordinator •Global Champ & Mentor
•iOS & WME ßeta Tester •Beacon, CCP & Wiki Master
•Master Raiders •Localization •Content Raider

[ img ]

USA | MapRaid!
orbitc
Master Raider
Master Raider
 
Posts: 6495
Joined: Mon Jun 25, 2012 1:51 pm
Location: USA
Has thanked: 2585 times
Been thanked: 6571 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby CBenson » Mon Apr 22, 2013 7:06 pm

kentsmith9 wrote:The point I was making earlier is . . .


Right, that seems similar to the situation like this.
TimeCross.png
(22.66 KiB) Downloaded 679 times

In this case both left turn traffic and cross traffic from Seg4 stops at the light and waits on Seg4. However, if there is a seperate left turn signal then the wait times on Seg4 at Jnct2 will be different depending on whether you go Seg4>Seg5>Seg7 or Seg4>Seg5>Seg6. But in either case there is no wait leaving Seg5 at Jnct3, so the difference would not be captured in the Seg5 data.

If waze can properly distinguish the time for turning left through Seg4>Seg5>Seg7 from going straight Seg4>Seg5>Seg6 in my example, then it would seem that waze should be able to properly distinguish the between the times for Seg7>Seg8>Seg9 and for Seg7>Seg8>Seg10 in your example.

The question then is can waze properly understand the turn times in these examples or not.
Regional Coordinator: Mid-Atlantic, US
Verizon, Nexus 6, Android 6.0.1, Waze 4.7.0.902
CBenson
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
 
Posts: 10330
Joined: Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:13 pm
Location: Crownsville, MD, US
Has thanked: 1055 times
Been thanked: 2353 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby kentsmith9 » Mon Apr 22, 2013 8:30 pm

Ah. This is a great example of where the split road is actually reducing the ability of Waze to properly monitor and route traffic, and because of the split intersection it cannot do that.

This is a good case where a bowtie intersection would still enable a split road AND provide the isolated left turn data.
USA: Now Idaho; previously California (Northern, SF/SJ)

[ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ]
PLEASE READ: Waze Map Editor (Start Here) | Editing Quick-start | Best Practices | Junctions
kentsmith9
Waze Global Champs
Waze Global Champs
 
Posts: 5681
Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2012 3:33 pm
Location: Boise ID and SF/SJ Bay Area of Northern California
Has thanked: 1574 times
Been thanked: 1786 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Timbones » Mon Apr 22, 2013 9:36 pm

I wonder if roundabouts suffer the same problem...

Making the unnamed segment longer may help alleviate the /potential/ problem with forks, but won't help with other kinds of problems. Unless Waze does something clever than we expect.

via mobile
Timbones(6) • UK Coordinator • Forum Moderator • Global Wiki Moderator • Routing Expert
Extensions: WME Colour HighlightsWME Route TesterWME Geometries
Timbones
Coordinators
Coordinators
 
Posts: 6923
Joined: Wed Feb 09, 2011 10:33 am
Location: York, UK
Has thanked: 1032 times
Been thanked: 2903 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Machete808 » Sun Apr 28, 2013 1:14 am

Permalink:

https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat ... s=12947865

Just to circle back on my issue noted earlier. Adding a short unnamed FREEWAY road segment produced the navigational prompt I wanted at the split between the EH-3 freeway and the EH-201. Now as you approach the split, you're told to stay to the right to get on the EH-201. That warns drivers so they don't find themselves bearing left onto the H-3:

wayfinder.png
(38.54 KiB) Downloaded 477 times


Previously I had tried an unnamed RAMP segment before the split and it didn't work. I'm sure that's explained somewhere in the Wiki, but I didn't get it.
Aloha,
Vicki
Hawaii State Manager
Area manager, Los Angeles, NYC
Country manager, U.S.,Thailand
[ img ] [ img ]
Need support?
support.google.com/waze > Popular topics > FAQs > Other > Open a ticket
Welcome, new editors:
Here's a good place to start!
Machete808
Country Manager
Country Manager
 
Posts: 1565
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 12:36 am
Location: Kaneohe, HI
Has thanked: 293 times
Been thanked: 328 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby Nacron » Sun Apr 28, 2013 1:25 am

vickimachado wrote:Permalink:

https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat ... s=12947865

Just to circle back on my issue noted earlier. Adding a short unnamed FREEWAY road segment produced the navigational prompt I wanted at the split between the EH-3 freeway and the EH-201. Now as you approach the split, you're told to stay to the right to get on the EH-201. That warns drivers so they don't find themselves bearing left onto the H-3:

wayfinder.png


Previously I had tried an unnamed RAMP segment before the split and it didn't work. I'm sure that's explained somewhere in the Wiki, but I didn't get it.


[ img ]

Would it look more tidy if that ramp to the eh201 was made into freeway type? Much like the little spur from w h201 to w h1?

Sent from my SPH-L710 using Tapatalk 2
2010 Subaru Legacy 2.5i | Sprint Samsung Galaxy S7 Edge | 7.0 | Waze 4.20.0.901 beta
Android Beta | WME Beta
Hawaii SM | Bangkok, Thailand RM | Phitsanulok, Thailand AM | West Virginia AM
[ img ][ img ][ img ][ img ]
Nacron
Map Raider
Map Raider
 
Posts: 418
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 9:08 pm
Location: Waipahu, HI
Has thanked: 28 times
Been thanked: 32 times

Re: Un-named segments for better navigation

Postby AlanOfTheBerg » Sun Apr 28, 2013 2:55 am

Vicki, the segment which should be unnamed is this one: https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... s=12925503. There's no reason for it to be named as it will never be shown on the navigation guidance. Then you can use two named ramp segments (one ramp segment named "to E H3 Fwy / Kaneohe" and the other named "to E H201 Fwy / Honolulu") at the split and both will be announced because the previous (long) segment was unnamed.

There's no need for all this extra kludgy stuff to be done.
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Country Manager | iPhone6 - VZ
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
 
Posts: 23623
Joined: Sat Aug 28, 2010 8:48 pm
Location: US Country Manager - Oregon, USA
Has thanked: 1111 times
Been thanked: 4859 times

PreviousNext

Return to Waze Map Editor

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Feedfetcher