Road Closures

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Re: Road Closures

Postby AnotherHiggins » Tue May 14, 2013 5:39 pm

Hi there, Riamus. Welcome to the wild world of Waze editing! Out of curiosity, what area are you editing in?

Riamus wrote:What is the best way to close an intersection where the intersection is still there, but the road is blocked off as a permanent closure?

For a permanent closure, the segments should definitely be disconnected in the Waze Map Editor (WME).

Waze uses "penalties" to decide which route to take. A turn restriction is considered a penalty so Waze prefers not to route that way, but depending on other road conditions Waze may still tell someone to turn there.

If the segments are not attached, that route is not even available to Waze.

As far as it looking funny on the client (phone app), if you get the segments close enough together then it shouldn't be noticeable.

Here's a page on the wiki that goes into more detail about how Waze calculates routes:

Riamus wrote:...I would be interested in some place we can mark permanent and long term closures for the state so we can limit the number of people "fixing" the closure.... Along the same lines, what is the best policy for temporary road closures that are still going to last for months due to construction? I saw an old post saying not to do anything because it took so long to update the maps and it would be open by the time the map was updated, but from what it looks like now, map updates are daily in the US so that wouldn't apply anymore.

That's what we're discussing in this thread - Roads & bridges that are closed due to construction and how to share that information with one another. You said you saw an "old post," so I assume you mean in the forums? If so, then you should always consider that any post that is years-old may be out-of-date.

Here's the wiki page on handling road closures.

But the gist is that you are correct - the North American tiles are (usually) updated several times a week. So any road that is going to be closed for several months should definitely be disconnected in the WME. I'd personally close a road that's expected to be closed for more than a week (unless I know of a problem where tiles are not being updated). Just make sure you stay on top of the situation so you can open it again when the construction has been completed.

Here's an example of a bridge that I've disconnected in the WME because it will be closed until next year: https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat ... s=69845602

And here's an example of a permanent road closure similar to what you're describing. In this case I actually used an additional segment to note that the road really does not connect: https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=6&lat ... s=67573279

If you'd like us to take a look at the intersection you're talking about, select the segment in the WME then click on the word "Permalink" at the bottom right of the screen. That will create a unique URL that will take us directly to where you're talking about (just like the link I posted above).
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Re: Road Closures

Postby AnotherHiggins » Wed May 15, 2013 6:39 pm

I'm pretty sure that the EULA indemnifies Waze if drivers fail to follow road signs and local laws. Every year that are stories of people who drive into lakes, or oceans, or off of bridges, etc. because their GPS said to. I'm not aware of any GPS manufacturers going out of business due to the crippling law suits.

But IANAL, so what do I know?

For Waze to route through a turn restriction is fairly rare, and often happens if there are errors nearby that prevent Waze from finding another route. But as I said, there is a penalty system in place and if routing through a restricted turn has fewer penalties than other routes, Waze will route right on through that restricted turn. In these cases, a higher-level editor can lock segment(s) at that node, which increases the penalty for turning there.

As for the additional segment I placed in the second example, I deliberately chose to make is a "street" rather than railroad specifically so it would be visible to drivers as well as editors. It won't show up on the client unless you are driving slowly or very nearby. And it doesn't look that strange on the client - it's not like it's a blinking neon sign that says "this is a fake street!" - it just looks like an informational note. One that's in all caps going perpendicularly across the road.

Waze is made for drivers and I try to keep in mind how things will look in the client. Yes, this is a bit of a kludge as there isn't actually a road there, but it can be very effective and look decent to the end user.



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Re: Road Closures

Postby AnotherHiggins » Wed May 15, 2013 10:50 pm

Regarding how it displays in the client, this is from the release notes for v3.6 (Android as well as iPhone):
"✓ Reduced map clutter by showing only relevant road names"

Actually I haven't tested this since the release of 3.6. I'll create a couple of test roads in a secluded area and see how they look in the client. I suspect it will be less noticeable than what I've seen in previous versions, but it can't hurt to check.

BTW, this is a technique I picked up from someone else.... FrisbeeDog, I think. The first time I saw it was actually in the client in a location where he had done this.

Riamus wrote:I'll get used to the practices used here and I'm not trying to be a pain. Just commenting and trying to get a good feel for how to do things.


No worries, and no offense taken here. Ideas should be challenged. If they stand up to the challenge they should be kept, otherwise they should be discarded. Repeat periodically.
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Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Wed Apr 24, 2013 3:02 pm

As I get more busy here at work I have been trying to get more organized with my Waze work. I have edited quite a few long term road closures in the state and would like to set up a list for the road closures so that everyone in the state can see and edit as needed.

I believe I have three options:

1) NC State to do list in the wiki - Might be an option but the US wiki pages by state probably needs to be reorganized to the new structure.

2) A common post here in the North Carolina State Topics

3) A post here linking to the Google Doc

What do you all think would work best for the community?
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Re: Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Thu Apr 25, 2013 2:01 pm

I do like the idea of a google doc. It was my first inclination of how to set it up.

Andy your wiki looks good as well. Have you had much success with others editing it though and keeping it up to date. I think a Google Doc is the way to go with permissions and such. It just seems to make things more fluid and easier than a wiki page could be. One benefit I can see is that there is no owner of the wiki page which is why I was considering it.

Thoughts?
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Re: Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Thu Apr 25, 2013 3:04 pm

BTW, Google Doc wise I was thinking of something like this.

NC Road Closures
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Re: Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Wed May 01, 2013 2:36 pm

Andy,

Where do you get to the main link to Connecticut from the wiki.

I searched for it and the wiki automatically points to the main page. (http://www.waze.com/wiki/index.php/Connecticut)

I just can't seem to find where the main Connecticut page is linked anywhere in the wiki besides doing a search. Do you just link to it through your signature? Also, do you care that I use your main page as a guide for North Carolina?
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Re: Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Wed May 15, 2013 5:57 pm

I was looking at your example with the additional road saying it's permanently closed. I'm not really sure I'd agree with that.


Speaking for myself I can see why he did that. The aerials show the road connected but it isn't connected now. He disconnects it but leaves no trace of why the road is disconnected. For some reason or another a MP or UR gets tagged at the intersection. New editor (or unfamiliar editor) comes by sees the aerial and say oh this must be connected and proceeds to connect the roads erroneously. The tag should help out with keeping this from happening. It should a prompt to email the editor of the segment at the very least otherwise you just aren't doing your job correctly.

Now the road ranks may not necessitate this exactly anymore. Just lock it down at the highest level you can get access to. Still, as a level 5 If I had an UR stating turn allowed here an old MP rear its ugly head for some reason. Looking at everything I might be tempted to connect the roads. Now if I recognized the editor of the segment or such it probably would prompt me to send a quick PM to him about it.
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Re: Road Closures

Postby HavanaDay » Wed May 15, 2013 6:27 pm

I am making an assumption that you are talking about permanent road closures that don't quite match with the aerials and the gps tracks that could contain some old data depending on the road.

If that is the case, I would tend to agree with you about using a segment type that isn't showing on the map. But, that isn't foolproof as well.

Now if you are talking about short term road closures then I think a type that will show up on the map could do two things. 1) Allow a end user to report an update request if the road is opened earlier (via the segment marked closed til XX/XX/XX) or 2) On the off chance that a road is going to be closed longer report that via an update request. If the road is separated but not marked (even if marked), there is a chance that a user may report a wrong driving directions uselessly.

Hopefully, down the road (near future would be nice) we can close roads as editors for specific lengths of times which, again, hopefully will eliminate these types of needs. This will not solve the permanently closed roads issue though so this will probably need further tweaking.

As an example:
This intersection here.

There is same major reconfiguration going on. I have over the past few months got conflicting info about which ramps are closed now and which are opened. As a matter of fact I received UR's on two separate days (spread apart by a couple days). One said new ramp is open, then a few days later got one that said ramp is not open yet. Conflicting info to say the least and the dot website hasn't been too helpful with it as well.
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Re: Road Closures

Postby Riamus » Tue May 14, 2013 3:54 pm

What is the best way to close an intersection where the intersection is still there, but the road is blocked off as a permanent closure? Just restrict all turns? Disconnect the road from the intersection? I'm thinking restricting turns makes the most sense because the road still does connect and it will look odd on a map if it doesn't connect. Eventually, the connection will probably be removed and then it would make sense to remove it on the map, but until then I'm thinking turn restrictions. And I would be interested in some place we can mark permanent and long term closures for the state so we can limit the number of people "fixing" the closure.

Along the same lines, what is the best policy for temporary road closures that are still going to last for months due to construction? I saw an old post saying not to do anything because it took so long to update the maps and it would be open by the time the map was updated, but from what it looks like now, map updates are daily in the US so that wouldn't apply anymore.
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