Get a sneak peek at whats next for Permanent Hazards on our April 7th Office Hours!
Post by AlanOfTheBerg
petervdveen wrote:So, if I'm correct this street is nameless.

Can you point me to the post that shows what is the reason for that?
Because it doesn't have a name.

http://www.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php ... 96#p545496 : kentsmith9 : "3a. If a driveway has no name, it should not be named. Names are for roads that have a visible sign that drivers can see in order to know where to turn (excluding when a sign is knocked down of course). Ehud told us not to kludge things in the map just to get something to work because then we have to undo all that is incorrect once they fix it."

http://www.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php ... 39#p547239: Riamus: "And I agree that 3a should not be done. Not only is it not correct, but it makes the map look bad. I've seen maps where every side street or driveway shown on it had the same name as the road. You couldn't really tell what parts were actually roads and which parts were driveways or which parts may be other roads with or without a name. It just creates a mess."

http://www.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php ... 38#p547538 : mapcat : "I agree with Kent's thoughts and recommendations."

http://www.waze.com/forum/viewtopic.php ... 41#p548341 : kentsmith9 : "However I would not recommend naming the "Private Road / Driveway" unless the name it is clearly visible to the driver as they approach the road in question."


The discussion then rather turns around where @sketch and @kentsmith9 appear to go back on the previous advice and advocate for naming private roads, after which I chime in again about private roads and parking lots. If we follow the latest advice from sketch and kent, then we'd be naming every parking lot road too, something I completely disagree with.

Having the (current) correct stop-point for an address be on the private (unnamed) road or parking lot segment is not reason enough to start naming all of them. This goes against what we've been asked by Ehud: not to kludge the map. We do still need to, but when it comes to this, I see no point. Waze doesn't use internal addresses and stop-points now, and likely won't for quite some time. As has been mentioned on the addressing topic several times in other threads, Waze has to make the stop point more flexible first. Otherwise, their stop-point routing will fail to get people to the right locations.
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 23627
Has thanked: 568 times
Been thanked: 3478 times
Send a message
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Ex-Global Champ Editor | iPhone13Pro - VZ

Post by AlanOfTheBerg
kentsmith9 wrote:Alan, I reread my posts and I don't see where sketch and I proposed naming parking lot roads, so maybe there is a word choice problem I don't recognize. I definitely do not support naming PLot roads, so maybe we can add a bullet to our page that specifically calls that out.
It was this that I picked up on: "...if the roadway is named (and possibly has addresses associated), it should be mapped."

sketch also wrote "Plus if there's an address assigned to it, then it's an address, and we need the named road so we can put an address point on it. That's the top reason for the blanket admissibility of named 'driveways' as I see it."

This caught my eye because it isn't clear what is meant by the "roadway is named" and has addresses associated. Because lots of editors have already named private roads which don't actually have a name, but they do have addresses associated with the main road. And we've talked here and I've read other threads where editors are advocating naming private unnamed driveways after the main roadway because then they can set addresses and a proper stop point.
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 23627
Has thanked: 568 times
Been thanked: 3478 times
Send a message
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Ex-Global Champ Editor | iPhone13Pro - VZ

Post by AlanOfTheBerg
sketch wrote:I disagree. If "Bollinger Crossing" is the name of the mall, and it's on a sign that looks like a street sign, the street should be named.
No, because it will say that also when navigating you out of the mall and that makes no sense. It certainly would be more confusing to be told to turn right and left four time at the "name of the mall" rather than the street name you are heading towards. What we need to have Waze do, rather than kludge the map, is nav instructions need to say "towards" instead of "at." And his has been discussed a lot before.
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 23627
Has thanked: 568 times
Been thanked: 3478 times
Send a message
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Ex-Global Champ Editor | iPhone13Pro - VZ

Post by AlanOfTheBerg
shellshock2872 wrote:Driveways should be to single houses not business, only to resident
That is dependent on length. I hope you read the entire thread.
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 23627
Has thanked: 568 times
Been thanked: 3478 times
Send a message
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Ex-Global Champ Editor | iPhone13Pro - VZ

Post by AlanOfTheBerg
kentsmith9 wrote:I lost track of this one. I plowed through the 11 pages again and I believe I have captured our general consensus in this new Driveway page.

I don't recall if this was a USA only set of recommendations and the page should be noted as such, or do we believe it is universal enough?
Thanks, Kent. That's a good first swipe. I made one change to "marked as Private Road" to read "set as Private Road type" because the first (marked) could be interpreted as "named."

I think some prettification, adding some example images would be good to move it to perfection.

I am not sure what the international community's opinion of this is. I would hope for universal application.
AlanOfTheBerg
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 23627
Has thanked: 568 times
Been thanked: 3478 times
Send a message
Wiki Resources: Map Editing Manual | alanoftheberg@gmail.com
Oregon-based US Ex-Global Champ Editor | iPhone13Pro - VZ

Post by AndyPoms
mapcat wrote:Here's what I'm talking about: https://www.waze.com/editor/?zoom=5&lat ... TTTTTTTTTT

Some of the houses at the edge of the development are closer to the surrounding roads than they are to the roads in front of them. Based on where the data points for each house are in Google or Bing are, Waze might attempt to route you to the wrong road. Adding driveways for each of the houses in that situation would solve that problem, but would look horrible and would lead to far more problems than it solved.
and with the new address system, completely unnecessary as the stop point would be on the road inside the complex. We just need to have the new address system go live...
AndyPoms
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 7223
Has thanked: 65 times
Been thanked: 990 times
Send a message
https://www.waze.com/wiki/images/f/ff/W ... 00k_6c.png
Waze Champ & Forum Moderator
USA Country Manager
Senior Area Manager: State of Connecticut
Wiki: Editing | Best Practices | FAQ

Post by AndyPoms
sketch wrote:The point is that we're making a clear set of rules, rather than allowing each editor to make their own. And drive-thrus are mapped, just not as private roads, so they're not under the ambit of our discussion.
Drive-thrus fall under the "Small Parking Lots" clause and are NOT mapped.
AndyPoms
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 7223
Has thanked: 65 times
Been thanked: 990 times
Send a message
https://www.waze.com/wiki/images/f/ff/W ... 00k_6c.png
Waze Champ & Forum Moderator
USA Country Manager
Senior Area Manager: State of Connecticut
Wiki: Editing | Best Practices | FAQ

Post by AndyPoms
sketch wrote:
AndyPoms wrote:
sketch wrote:The point is that we're making a clear set of rules, rather than allowing each editor to make their own. And drive-thrus are mapped, just not as private roads, so they're not under the ambit of our discussion.
Drive-thrus fall under the "Small Parking Lots" clause and are NOT mapped.
Which is changing. Read Alan's post above. We're discussing updating the Wiki to standards that actually work. Lets not use outdated existing Wiki thinking in our discussion.
Aside from the occasional MP, I've never had a problem at my local McWendyKing with Waze (it is not mapped). So, why should we consider changing something that is working? I know Ehud wants these things mapped, but unless they fix the display issues associated with parking lots (and the navigation issues that I've heard send people to the wrong exit) I don't think we should change anything (yet).
AndyPoms
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 7223
Has thanked: 65 times
Been thanked: 990 times
Send a message
https://www.waze.com/wiki/images/f/ff/W ... 00k_6c.png
Waze Champ & Forum Moderator
USA Country Manager
Senior Area Manager: State of Connecticut
Wiki: Editing | Best Practices | FAQ

Post by AndyPoms
jasonh300 wrote:
AndyPoms wrote:Aside from the occasional MP, I've never had a problem at my local McWendyKing with Waze (it is not mapped). So, why should we consider changing something that is working? I know Ehud wants these things mapped, but unless they fix the display issues associated with parking lots (and the navigation issues that I've heard send people to the wrong exit) I don't think we should change anything (yet).
I've been mapping them as conservatively as possible when MPs come up, but I agree with AndyPoms (and have been pestering the developers for months) that the display of these roads needs to change if we're ever going to have functional parking lot navigation because adding in all these PLot roads makes the map look REALLY BAD.
Not to mention confusing...
AndyPoms
EmeritusChamps
EmeritusChamps
Posts: 7223
Has thanked: 65 times
Been thanked: 990 times
Send a message
https://www.waze.com/wiki/images/f/ff/W ... 00k_6c.png
Waze Champ & Forum Moderator
USA Country Manager
Senior Area Manager: State of Connecticut
Wiki: Editing | Best Practices | FAQ

Post by Aqualung812
So, did this topic die? I've recently restarted editing in my area & plan to add driveways in rural areas as private roads if they are >~100m.
I've searched the wiki & do not see an entry yet. Should I create something on the Wiki, or wait for more guidance from the rank 4-6 people I see discussing this issue a few months ago?
Aqualung812
Posts: 19
Has thanked: 18 times
Been thanked: 2 times
Send a message