Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversation

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Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversation

Postby Pizuz » Mon Nov 11, 2013 6:31 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:
pizuz wrote:I think I found a serious bug... of some sort:

When batch-selecting a couple of segments that don't bear the same street name or city name (no common street and no common city), editing one of those fields deletes the contents of the other one.

This has been like this in the editor for two years. This is why, and the interface is quite clear, the No Name checkbox is selected for those fields which will be set that way if you continue.

There have been proposals to Waze to make multiple-selections more user friendly, but none have been enacted yet. Waze doesn't consider this a serious enough issue (it is not a bug) to spend time changing it at this time.


I guessed that this behavior was intended, but wouldn't it be possible to issue an explicit warning in that case? At least once?
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Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversation

Postby Pizuz » Tue Nov 12, 2013 1:57 pm

foxitrot wrote:
pizuz wrote:I guessed that this behavior was intended, but wouldn't it be possible to issue an explicit warning in that case? At least once?

I could not imagine one reason for such behavior to be intended. Except for simplifying the necessary code...


My thoughts, exactly... But even for simplicity's sake, WME shouldn't allow unsuspecting users to do that much damage that easily, without at least giving out a fair warning about what's going to happen if they click on Save.

By the way, thanks for responding. Both of you ;)
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Re: Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversati

Postby russblau » Sun Nov 10, 2013 4:19 pm

jasonh300 wrote:
elle-emme wrote:
jasonh300 wrote:How do we handle users with driven area permissions that allow them to start conversations in URs but have no ability to edit anything on major roads in the area because their level is too low, and therefore no hope of being able to solve anything?


Perhaps it wasn't your intention, but what I got from that statement is "what good are these useless low-ranked editors? All they can do is ask questions and then not be able to fix anything!"

Which, as a low-ranked editor, is rather offensive :|


That was exactly my intention. If you ask a question, you're misrepresenting yourself as being able to potentially fix the problem. The low ranked editors are forbidden to edit certain areas and should also be forbidden to be involved in conversations that they can't hope to solve.

In the case here, the lower ranked editors have their own assigned areas where they have full permissions, and have ignored warnings to leave the URs alone that they can't solve that are outside of their area.


Wow! Elle-emme, rest assured that not everyone feels that way. To me, if an editor's questions or comments are helping to clarify or resolve an issue, then their rank doesn't matter. For that matter, anyone whose comments aren't constructive shouldn't be editing, and in that case their rank shouldn't matter either.
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Re: Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversati

Postby russblau » Sun Nov 10, 2013 10:02 pm

jasonh300 wrote:This isn't about comments. It's about misrepresenting yourself as a person who can solve a problem when you can't. That will drive users away just as quickly as lying to them about having solved a UR when you haven't done anything.

I guess that is possible, depending on what the comment says, but just asking for additional information or directing the user to information in the Wiki (for example) would not be "misrepresentation" in any way.

jasonh300 wrote:When you make the initial comment on a UR, you become responsible for that UR. Nobody else is going to get a notification that the reporter has replied. So now, the lower level user has to ask for an unlock, or ask for someone else to fix the problem, creating additional complication.

We've worked on and tested this feature for 6 months now to make it a DIRECT communication between the editor and the reporter. Obviously this isn't how it's going to work now that everyone has access to it. This is quickly going to turn into an unmanageable mess.


It sounds like you want Waze to design and implement a feature different from the one they actually implemented. You want a PRIVATE communication between one editor and one reporting user, but Waze has designed a communication tool that allows collaboration among multiple map editors. Perhaps you don't like collaboration. In my opinion, it's a good thing, but I understand that everyone has their own opinion.
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Re: Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversati

Postby sasprin » Mon Nov 11, 2013 11:39 pm

I'm looking forward to get started!
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Re: New Editor Version! Scheduled Restrictions and Conversat

Postby siklalez » Mon Nov 04, 2013 3:29 am

Sounds good, I'll clear cookies in my browsers and I hope that features available in the WME.
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Re: Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversati

Postby sketch » Tue Nov 12, 2013 6:56 pm

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:@jasonh300 I think you're being overly critical and restrictive. This is a collaborative environment and the handful of country managers can't fix everything. We've got to have newer editors looking at URs and looking to solve map issues too.

I didn't even think URs showed up outside a user's editable area, which means they could have rights to fix the issues within that area. If URs show up everywhere now, that's a WME issue which should be fixed.

elle-emme wrote:
jasonh300 wrote:So now, the lower level user has to ask for an unlock, or ask for someone else to fix the problem, creating additional complication.

As long as the lower-ranked editor does that, is it really such an issue? How is it any different than a low-ranked editor running across the same problem during their normal editing of the map and posting an unlock request in the forum?

I agree. Just because there is a conversation going on, asking for an unlock is no different now than before. Hundreds of editors every month ask for unlocks because of a UR they can't resolve due to rank. This is a normal part of the editing workflow. This is not an additional complication. We've been doing this for years.

jasonh300 wrote:We've worked on and tested this feature for 6 months now to make it a DIRECT communication between the editor and the reporter. Obviously this isn't how it's going to work now that everyone has access to it. This is quickly going to turn into an unmanageable mess.

I disagree. Now I don't have to worry about trying to solve ALL URs in my area using conversations. What I didn't think about in testing is a way to quickly, visually ID URs which I have participated in. Like the Participated list for the forum in Tapatalk.

elle-emme wrote:If you worked on and tested it for six months, then how did this issue never come up? Did no one ever bring up the possibility of rank-locking conversations according to the rank lock of the road the UR was reported on?

But a good % of URs aren't about the road they are reported on anyway, so that's one reason it didn't come up. And I don't think it is worth the effort to pursue as a feature. The whole "issue" with multiple editors being involved in URs and the possible problems with it was partly due to not a lot of overlap between editors. But even before public release, we had issues with URs being closed improperly and having a conversation tool is not going to change it.

elle-emme wrote:edit: also, if it's such a big deal that plebeian editors are forbidden from initiating conversations on roads that are rank-locked and only patrician editors should do so, why isn't it addressed in the Wiki article about URs and conversations?

IMO, it isn't, and therefore, it isn't.

Regarding this, and the instant case:

I don't think low-level editors should be locked out of starting conversations. That's too extreme, and it doesn't really get to the heart of the problem here.

The problem in the instant case is that the low-level editor in question is immediate-blanket-responding in sloppy English to every UR in an area, 80 miles from his managed area, which is managed quite well by two Level 6 Country Managers.

As a matter of simple etiquette between editors, in proactively managed areas, editors who, (1) do not manage the area in question, and (2) are not local to that area, should allow a few days for the area manager, or someone local to the area, to follow through with editors first.

Managers and locals know their area best, and are best suited to fix issues in their area. If they're not on top of things, of course, other editors can come in and help out. But inexperienced and/or sloppy editors who take a day trip to a city with a well-maintained map are not in a position to help nearly as well as the editors who maintain that map so well.
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Re: Official feedback thread - v1.3 - Schedules & Conversati

Postby sketch » Tue Nov 12, 2013 8:16 pm

I'm not proposing any changes to the editor or the way URs are handled—just a simple rule of etiquette to be followed by (and, in extreme cases, enforceable against) editors.

Area managers look at their areas and see conversation markers and assume that they—or one of their co-managers, or a local editor—have assumed the responsibility for that issue. It's not good policy to allow day-trip editors to immediately undertake responsibility in an area with which they aren't familiar, when there are other, better-equipped editors who are ready and willing to take responsibility and action.

That said, an addition to the in-map UR marker which shows whether you're following that UR would be helpful in situations like these. See one that's been replied to and that you're not following, and follow it; then you can keep an eye on it and perhaps help a newer editor resolve the situation if necessary.
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Re: New Editor Version! Scheduled Restrictions and Conversat

Postby SuperDave1426 » Sun Nov 03, 2013 5:56 pm

ohad-ron wrote:Conversations - this feature lets you talk directly from the editor with people who have reported update requests. Client users are able to reply directly from the client, and you will get a notification to your client and an email when they respond.


Thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you! I've lost count of how many times I've seen a "General error (user reported)" with no other information provided by the user, and the path information being displayed was insufficient to figure out the problem, so I've just had to mark the issue as "solved" to get it off the map. This should be a BIG help to let us clear those up in a more meaningful way! :mrgreen:
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Re: New Editor Version! Scheduled Restrictions and Conversat

Postby SuperDave1426 » Sun Nov 03, 2013 6:40 pm

AndyPoms wrote:You should have been marking those as "Not Identified" as you didn't solve the issue they were reporting. Only MPs should never be marked as "Not Identified", NOT URs.


Sorry. I *meant* to say "Not identified." My bad.

Yes, I'll admit that once or twice I did a "solved" because it really looked like it might have simply been an accidental report based on other information (street view, turn restrictions checked, road directions checked, etc.), but the vast majority of the time it was marked as "not identified." Now that you've made that clarification for me, I'll be sure that in the future I *never* mark a "I didn't solve it" UR as "solved." (Though like I said, most of the time I "not identified" them).

Thanks, and I'll be more careful in the future! :-)
Last edited by SuperDave1426 on Sun Nov 03, 2013 9:36 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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