No through traffic

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Re: No through traffic

Postby CBenson » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:19 pm

sketch wrote:CBenson, maybe we should tell staff about it.


I raised it with Amit in the context of parking lot roads back when I became aware of the issue in this thread. But maybe its worth repeating and noting that (not surprisingly) its the same for private roads.
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Re: No through traffic

Postby CBenson » Sat Aug 30, 2014 11:04 am

sketch wrote:Want to add it to the form?

Sure, done.
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Re: No through traffic

Postby CBenson » Sun Aug 31, 2014 4:22 pm

The result from submitting this example on the form is:
The penalty for going out of the parking lot road is given. The problem is, that the penalties on the first segment are taken with a factor of the location on the segment. Since we are about mid-segment here, only 50% of the penalty is used. We will look into this further to see how we can fix it. ​
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Re: No through traffic

Postby davielde » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:36 pm

CBenson wrote:I don't see why the private installation or community definition can't state:
"The smallest example may be a single private community street protected by a gate or 'No Thru Traffic' sign."

I have used Private Road successfully for one segment where the sign is present for no Thru Traffic or "Local Traffic Only", etc.

Another instance where I have used it two or three times is where there have been no signs, but URs have complained about Waze finding a shortcut, but local police regularly monitor the street for people "avoiding the light" at a main intersection. If this is an acceptable use of "Private Road", then it may merit a separate page outside of Private Installations specifically geared toward smaller applications.
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Re: No through traffic

Postby driving79 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 5:48 pm

For the 2nd example, I would use the private in, street out that is used for private installations....only on the one from the ramp (that sign is confusing to me). As for the first example I would be ok with the one segment as private, how it is now, because you have street types on either side of it so routing should send people out correctly. You could do the private in, street out for the 1st example, but I think it's overkill and the one private road should accomplish what is needed, so keep it more simple. I would also test the heck out of the 1st example to make sure it's doing what is desired, once live (including leaving a home from inside the private segment).

We have tons and tons of these in Florida, especially Orlando or the nicer areas, where entire neighborhoods which would be great to cut through, are not allowed. If you mark all the streets inside these as all private, it does not route you back out of it correctly. The only way we have had 100% success is with the private in, street out.
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Re: No through traffic

Postby driving79 » Tue Jun 24, 2014 8:11 pm

So what if I'm coming off the ramp and going straight because I live there? Wouldn't a TR stop that? I don't think they really want tons of people turning right from Sawtelle that don't live in there either, I get it's not clearly posted from that direction. If you only do the TR from the ramp, then waze may do funky routes from the ramp to get them to turn right onto Sawtelle, uturn using other streets nearby and then turn right onto it (because it would still be faster). Not ideal.
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Re: No through traffic

Postby DwarfLord » Mon Jun 23, 2014 9:45 pm

If I understand the implementation of "Private Road" it is in fact defined as no thru traffic. Thus the primary use would be for neighborhoods closed to thru traffic, and use for private installations would be a special case!


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Re: No through traffic

Postby DwarfLord » Sun Aug 10, 2014 9:46 pm

With regard to the thread title -- "No through traffic" -- another special case has come up.

A mountainous area near me with a mix of good and poor roads sees occasional URs from people routed onto the poor roads. Usually this is due to drivers overshooting and Waze trying to get them turned around. Once it appeared to happen because Waze simply didn't know how slow the road was. This stands to reason if roads are so bad Wazers never go that way, and/or cell coverage is spotty.

In particular this has come up for Morrell Rd and Morrill Rd on either side of Summit Rd:

https://www.waze.com/editor/?env=usa&lo ... 957&zoom=4

Recently an editor saw some of the URs being worked and solved the problem by setting the questionable roads to Private. The editor locked them to 3, I assume to prevent another well-meaning editor from changing them back since the roads are actually public and unrestricted (as far as I know).

Question: is it an appropriate use of the Private road type to prevent Waze from using roads that, while completely public and unrestricted, have been reported to be of poor quality? If not, what is a better solution?

[EDIT/p.s. I have asked the UR reporters more than once if any dirt road sections are involved, but have yet to get a response. If some part of these roads can be marked as dirt, that would of course solve the problem.]
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Re: No through traffic

Postby DwarfLord » Tue Aug 12, 2014 5:25 am

Regarding the SV on Morrell and Morrill, I thought I checked that some time ago and the imagery was partial; it did not extend end-to-end. But maybe I missed something! I will check again.

In any event, may I suggest the following addition to the Road Types/USA wiki article:
Suggested addition to Road Types/USA#Private Road wrote:{{As of|2014|8}} the Waze client does not display private roads differently from public roads, but this behavior may change in the future. To maintain display consistency in anticipation of that time, the Private Road type should never be used for unrestricted public roads. Do not use the Private Road type as a workaround to force Waze to avoid slow public roads, for example those with rough patches or construction.

I'm not sure what this means for the situation that started this conversation, a public road restricted by enforceable signs to local traffic only. We solved this by marking it private but technically it's not. Should it be marked as a parking-lot road instead?
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Re: No through traffic

Postby DwarfLord » Thu Aug 14, 2014 3:01 am

I did a bit of wordsmithing and included the "no through traffic" case as well. This is what the wiki now says. Please feel welcome to revert or modify as desired!
Updated Road Types / USA wiki wrote:As with Parking-Lot Roads, a route over a Private Road will incur a transition penalty upon leaving it for another road type. This transition penalty keeps Waze from routing Wazers through a private area as a shortcut. Unlike Parking-Lot Roads, however, Private Roads do not suppress automated traffic jams in the Waze application.

As of August 2014 the Waze client does not display private roads differently from public roads, but this behavior may change in the future. To maintain display consistency in anticipation of that time, the Private Road type should never be used for unrestricted public roads. Do not use the Private Road type as a workaround to force Waze to avoid slow public roads, for example those with rough patches or construction. In special cases, however, the Private Road type may be used for a public street that is legally and enforceably signed for local traffic only.
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