CBenson wrote:

PesachZ wrote:The easiest instructions to new editors, when the wrong instructions are being given at a junction and everything is named correct, may be to set up a wayfinder.
Wayfinders stubs should be set without any alternate names.

Hold that thought. Waze staff is currently trying to convince me that ramp wayfinder stubs adversely affect routing. I'm not convinced yet. This is in connection with the routing issue raised here. The routing team doesn't understand why this segment exists. (So at the very least, the routing algorithms have been developed without contemplating what effects these ramp wayfinder segments may have on routing.)

pumrum wrote:

PesachZ wrote: Make the first 5 meters of this ramp be a no name segment.

Of course there are probably 1000 ways to solve this particular issue. I'm not sure that breaking the ramp into 2 parts is my favorite, since that would break our numbered route continuity concept at which point I may as well just remove the alt name from the ramp as it exists now and not add extra junctions.

I guess the points I was trying to illustrate was:

1) aren't we supposed to avoid clobbering hacks into the map to circumvent fundamental issues with the software? I know that guidance has been handed down before, but I'm mobile so I can't locate it just now

2) why would you ever, in any circumstance want a ramp as a sole right branch from a continuous highway to NOT give an instruction? It doesn't make any sense to me at all, given my limited but growing knowledge of Waze. If anyone can think of a reason, I'm sure PesachZ (the turn instruction guru) can

sketch wrote:

AlanOfTheBerg wrote:I cannot wait until we get the Junction Box so we can remove wayfinder segments completely.

I hope Junction Box is even what we think it's going to be. Some offhand comments by staff lead me to believe there's a chance that, while it'll allow native handling of U turns at divided-roadway intersections etc., it might not allow for some of the other things we have been expecting it to (viz., manual control of the particular instruction given and of the best continuation). I've also seen it referred to as "Big Junction" which seems to imply its function is handling large junctions (i.e., junctions between divided roadways).

Timbones wrote:I'm still struggling to get my head around these rules. Maybe they would be easier to understand if written the other way around, detail which combination of segments would produce instructions?

In particular, I'm looking for the simplest configuration which doesn't disrupt the detour avoidance algorithm and, if possible, doesn't require stubs. I've found a couple solutions that do work with stubs, but none without. I thought some of the rules on the alt name spreadsheet would allow at least one combination (rule #14 onwards).

My tests can be found here. See point places for notes, the two parks (green) are the ones that work.

Timbones wrote:I appreciate we only have reverse engineered rules so far, so look I forward to hearing what the devs say...

In my tests, I'm trying to generate 'keep right' instructions for drivers staying on the Freeway, plus 'keep left' for those exiting it (left-hand drive country). I'd like to find a simple recipe that will work for all our junctions, while at the same time preventing any off-and-on-again detours. This means keeping the primary name continuous on the Freeway. (Yes, I know I can use cross-matching alt name on a wayfinder, but that's a hack on top of a hack which I'd like to avoid).

I generally dislike using stubs, as they either look ugly or fall below Waze's 5m minimum. However, it seems that the only way to get keep left/right instructions is to use stubs, unless there's a configuration I've missed in my testing?

I think the reason I find the wiki page hard to follow is that it's all about how Best Continuation is determined, while I'm looking for the inverse; when Keep Instructions are generated.

Timbones wrote:The one working solution I've found so far is to use Freeway stubs, and the same alt name in all 3 segments (see Test B). This leaves the primary names unchanged, so if the rules change then the detour avoidance will still work, and the map hacks are not visible.

Timbones wrote:I think I could live with that. What would you suggest instead? Wouldn't ramp stubs result in an exit instruction to stay on the Freeway?

DwarfLord wrote:

sketch wrote:Ah, that may be the deciding factor then? From what I understand, disconnected routing is not per se "supported" and may lead to some weird stuff... I don't really know anything more than that, though. It does seem odd that this would give a turn instruction in any case.

Thanks! I didn't realize unconnected routing was considered unsupported since the app does try. I imagined it was either going to work well (although of course without real-time traffic adjustments) or it wasn't going to work at all, depending on whether app cached the necessary part of the map before it lost connectivity.

Maybe the app compresses its internal map cache so heavily as to corrupt best-continuation situations...?

qwaletee wrote:I would think we would not change things much.

For someone routing into the area, it won't matter at all, if they are sticking to route. For someone driving out or driving locally, I guess it could matter. Hopefully, they'll learn that Waze doesn't provide fantastic routing unless they start on Wi-Fi.

Many "lack of routing server" features wouldn't matter anyway. No traffic data? Can't change editing to account for it. Lack of TBTR? Before we had TBTR, we still mapped those turns, and got a UR once in awhile about restricted hours. And so on.

If you can think of a lost feature that might make you want to map differently, bring it up and we'll have a lively discussion.

SeZAKxing wrote:Is there a minimum ramp length to generate an "Exit Right"?
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S-in is Major Highway "US-250 E, Charlottesville, Virginia"
S-1/best continuation is "US-250 E, Charlottesville, Virginia"
S-out is 50m ramp "Locust Ave / St. Charles Ave, Charlottesville, Virginia"
angles at ID: 43599247 179, 22, 160

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