[Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuvers

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Tue Apr 21, 2015 2:06 pm

iamrioo wrote:Hello guys.

I am sorry if this ever asked before, or maybe its already basic known for all of you :D

Sometime we need to make a junction that say keep and turn, but so far I tried in many ways it didn't work unless, there is an additional segment connected to the same junction (3rd S-out) like below image.

[ img ]

Do I missed something here? to make it works both keep and Turn? without that "illegal" 3rd segment
:shock:

Thanks

No you did not miss something, if it is truly needed to have a keep and a turn where there are only two parts, you'll need a second "keep" path. But at you mentioned it is a hack and not recommended.

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Thu Apr 23, 2015 2:12 am

qwaletee wrote:PZ< let's qualify. It is not recommended unless it truly necessary. If you have another way around it that's reasonable, avoid it. For example, if both COULD be a keep or both COULD be a turn, that might be better. Or you can sometimes accomplish this with a wayfinder, which is more acceptable.

The main reasons hacks are discouraged:
1) They are awkward, many editors won't recognize them, and may think they are just a bad edit
2) Since they rely on some esoteric behaviors of the routing engine (or other part of Waze), it is possible that these behaviors may change and turn the hack into a bad map edit

But we won't let those stop us from making a map work today if it is currently misbehaving in a significantw ay and there is no alternative.

When I say not recommended, I mean that there is no support for this type of editing in the wiki. just because I am saying here that it works doesn't mean that I am recommending you do it

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Thu May 14, 2015 11:10 am

vectorspace wrote:I could use some expert help in a related (or same subject). I looked around and didn't find anything quickly.

Topic: TTS announcing continuation routes (or whatever they are called).

Example 1:

When two separately-named roads (A and B) are joined at a point, for instance at 90 degrees, and there is no other turn option other than to turn right or left (depending on which way you're going), Waze will not announce "Turn right on B"... it seems to assume you must turn right/left so announces nothing.

Example 2:

Same as in Example 1; however, there is a nearby (such as 50 feet or so further on the path) left turn one must take (on road C) after making the mandatory turn. Before one reaches the mandatory turn at A/B, Waze will announce the subsequent left turn on C.

Example 1 is slightly confusing (due to omission) because it makes no announcement that there is a turn. This is somewhat passable.

Example 2 is rather confusing because let's say you must make a right turn from A to B (mandatory) and then left on C. Before you ever turn right while on A, Waze is telling you to turn left a bit down the road. It would be better if it said "turn right on A then left on C."

Example 3 could be that two roads, A and B are joined at near 180 degrees. Waze will not state "continue straight on B" as one transitions from A to B without turn.

Tgfathergoose was having an issue with MPs on this topic and I know I have heard some discussion on these things. Can anyone shed light on current knowledge. I didn't find it in the Wiki either.

Thanks!

Everything you stated is working as designed, and is explained in the wiki though it is complex. the junction style guide controlling turn instructions section touches on it. There's also 2 technical wiki pages that this thread refers to which discuss it a bit further and explain how it works.

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Tue Jun 30, 2015 5:01 am

I want to start a discussion on adding documentation and guidance for two segment uturns. This feature was included in the uturn feature roll with client v 3.9.4 but got little attention. It has been tested extensively for the development of the Junction Angle Info script.

The current findings show a turn between two segments, regardless of if other segments are connected to the same Junction, will provide a "make a Uturn" prompt. Provided the turnangle is above 168.24° ±0.5°. There have been inconsistent results in the gray area (167.74°-168.74°) sometimes giving a turn left, others a uturn.

There will need be a change to the algorithm, the existing algorithm never gives any propmt if there are only two segments connected, but in the case of 2 segments connected >170° there is a uturn prompt.

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Wed Jul 01, 2015 11:51 am

The base content is the same, this would be the very precise technical version, notice the angles.

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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Thu Aug 13, 2015 1:46 am

I updated the message box I had placed on this page regarding the changes and alt names. It now reflects reality as was explained to me by the NY meetup, and has since been implemented.

I also updated the flowchart image, and the list of conditions to include the U-turn prompt given at angles >169.8 (shown as >170°)
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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Fri Sep 18, 2015 7:17 pm

subs5 wrote:Can this page have a link to the interactive algorithm page since better angle descriptions including u-turns? Thanks in advance. V/r subs5

It does already right above the table of contents, if I'm understanding you correctly.
A simplified easy to understand interactive version of this page is available here.
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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:03 pm

subs5 wrote:
PesachZ wrote:
subs5 wrote:Can this page have a link to the interactive algorithm page since better angle descriptions including u-turns? Thanks in advance. V/r subs5

It does already right above the table of contents, if I'm understanding you correctly.
A simplified easy to understand interactive version of this page is available here.


Hi PesachZ,
I do not see where the >170 degree turn is announced as a U turn. The three circular diagrams for angles does not show a wedge at the 6 o'clock position that is 20 degrees wide that says "u-turn". Here is a crude picture of the wedge.

This is the portion that I would like on your page "Is the Turn angle from the origin to the the destination greater than 170°? [then] YES => Make a U-turn"

I do not see that mentioned on your page. Most of the other information is there but nada about u-turns. V/r subs5

They are not in the diagrams, correct. The diagrams main intent to explain the concept of how angles work, and how doglegs affect them. On the How Waze determined ... page in the graphic flowchart the >170°is mentioned in the first decision triangle at the top. It is also the first item in the list of conditions:
If the angle between s-in and s-out is greater than 169°, the instruction is: 'Make a U-turn'


In the Interactive algorithm page the first question in the algorithm is about these >170 °u-turns, which lead to the u-turn prompt.
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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Sun Sep 20, 2015 12:39 pm

CBenson wrote:Yes, I remember this issue now. That chart never updates on the page for me. Doesn't matter if I'm logged in or using someone else computer. Displayed on the page for me is the 1:30 11 June 2014 version. If I click on the image, I get the file page with showing the current version. If I remember correctly, its been this way for me since June 2014. I've forgotten recently to make sure I click through to the file page to see the current version.

Interesting, I see I have the same issue now that you mention it. A page pruge didn't fix it either, I wonder what the fix is.
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Re: [Page Update] How Waze determines turn/keep/exit maneuve

Postby PesachZ » Tue Feb 09, 2016 6:59 pm

subs5 wrote:The chart diagrams with the U-turn angles are still not visible. They disappeared again.

With all our new webinar editors it would be great to get this visual cue working again. Thanks

Honestly I'm not exactly sure why the wiki hates this image so much. It's all coded correctly in there.
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