I understand the PNH mods currently have the Post Office category in their “discussion” queue. So, I know this post may be unnecessary or unwanted. However, I wanted to start a thread to gather input on the use of the Post Office category.
As stated by sketch, when a Waze user searches for “Post Office” in WMA, WMA does a “category search” for the nearest post offices. Therefor, it could lead to a negative experience if we are marking anything but USPS (United States Postal Service) Stations as “Post Office”. I understand there are other USPS locations that operate inside another location, and these could possibly be marked as a Post Office via a second place point. However, the point of this thread is to attempt to gather a consensus among all the regions on what they choose to use the Post Office category for and why / why not others.
I hope we can speed the process along to get the Post Office category a national standard. At the same time, though this might need to be a second conversation thread, we really need a national standard for USPS station naming. As I have looked through the WMEPH spreadsheets (yes, I know this isn’t PNH directly, but usually the WMEPH is built to use the decisions made in PNH), the USPS station naming is all over the board.
I would suggest “post office” be limited to actual USPS locations and shopping and services for everything else. If Waze came up with new categories this could change. But for now, a true USPS location should be the deciding factor.
I totally agree that naming should be nationalized. It’s not like the USPS has different naming in each state. We shouldn’t either.
While I don’t see the need, I have no issue with information being added to the Wiki that specifies that the Post Office category is only supposed to be used on actual USPS locations. Post Office category should not be used on “authorized” locations.
As for the naming convention of Post Offices, the PNH Mods have been trying to come to an agreement it. (Not as simple as one might think )
Why do you not see the need? It’s been a question asked by many new editors and even some seasoned editors. Lately, I’ve seen improper guidance to marking things like UPS drop boxes as Post Office.
I just think most of the mistakes are misreading UPS as USPS since they are very similar. Again, I have no issues with adding information but I don’t know if it will solve the issue with the names being so similar that people (myself included) misread it.
Agreed. It won’t stop the misreading and mislabeling based on that, but would stop the “should I put post office on insert anything but USPS” answers from being Yes.
What are the threasholds for whether a USPS location is marked as Post Office? Personally, I believe if a place handles USPS mail be it by person on kiosk it should be marked as Post Office. This includes any Contract Post Office or Automated Post Kiosk. At these locations, you can do most post office services. I think the only thing that may vary is if there’s PO boxes or passport photos. I know of one contract post office that used to be a full fledged location but they converted it to a contract basis.
I guess the best way to answer that, or discuss it more would be: “Why would someone, whether native to the area or a visitor, search for a post office?” The answers to that would help dictate what should be marked.
I agree with @Nacron. If somebody has a specific need for specific USPS services, that’s not Waze’s responsibility at that point. We are not a USPS services directory, nor should we be. We will help them get to the USPS they want to go to, but it’s up to them to know which one has the passport/PO box/etc they need. They can go to usps.com to verify the available services. Potentially, WMEPH could even pop that in the description, if approved by the regions’ moderators.
It is reasonable to expect us to properly place the Post Office category on places that a typical person would call a post office. In my experience, that would be limited to USPS, but it would not exclude self-service mailing options that are provided by USPS. If a place is more like courier/parcel services such as FedEx and UPS, then in my view, Shopping/Services is better suited.
Correct. That’s why I started this thread. Most people will search “post office” and not specifically “USPS” or “United States postal service”. And when someone does a search for “post office” WMA does a category search, not a name match search.
The other services a post office offers can be found at other companies as well: Passport photos at Walgreens, CVS, Walmart, just about anywhere that does photo printing these days. PO Box: lots of places. Either of those and you’ll likely search “post office boxes near me”, “passport photos near me”, etc. As for FedEx / UPS, I’m going to search those specifically by name. I would have never thought to search “post office” and expect a UPS or FedEx Office location to be among the results.
So “post office” to me would specifically mean “USPS” regardless of self service or fully managed.
If there is a verifiable problem of people mistaking “UPS” for “USPS” then there needs to be a note on the page. On the other hand, if it is a problem of not knowing what category to use for “any kind of shipping store, like UPS, FedEX or Mail 'N More Plus” for US
The reason for this decision should be on the page (When you type post office into waze, it does not search for places with post office in the name; it only searches for things with the category post office)
Next, it would be necessary to nail down what qualifies as a Post Office.
I don’t think Mail 'N More Plus qualifies, even though they sell stamps and sell USPS mailing services. I don’t just drop off a bunch of USPS-stamped packages and letters there because accepting huge quantities of postal mail that they don’t get paid for does not pay their bills. Stuff I’ve stamped or labeled myself, I take directly to the actual USPS post office.
Once upon a time, I used to try to figure out the closest mailbox to my route while I’m out driving so I could mail something. Waze does not have a category for USPS mailbox. And I’m mailing a lot less stuff these days, anyway. So I don’t think we need to discuss USPS mailbox.
I believe a Post Office is a USPS only (in the United States)). That is, it has a zip code attached to it (sometimes more than one). If it expands would it include Fedex, DHL UPS and other companies that provide services for any or all of the above? BTW, I think we should add zip code(s) to our post office entries in the comments.
Post Office in the US should be for USPS official locations, such as USPS owned and contract locations (e.g., inside stores or even standalone). Just this past weekend I was looking for an open Post Office, and Waze failed to give me the one-and-only contract location open on a Saturday morning.
Waze should NOT return the “authorized agent” facilities such as Mailboxes Etc., Pack-n-Ship, FedEx, etc.
I don’t really see a benefit to that. Other than knowing my own zip, I don’t know any others, so having it listed in Comments wouldn’t provide me anything other than possibly the fact that it is the one for the town that shows up in my Search in the app. How often does someone search for a zip code? I’d probably do a regular web search for that. When I do a search in the app, I don’t see a zip listed anywhere.
I think we all agree that only USPS locations should get the post office category, but the confusion starts there, since there are many kinds of USPS locations, such as US Post Offices, Approved Postal Providers, self-service kiosks, passport services and whatnot. Among Approved Postal Providers there are retailers that just sell stamps like Office Depot but also Contract Postal Units and Village Post Offices, which provide some or all of the services of a full post office. It seems simple to say that only US Post Offices should get the post office category, but if we do that we are actually excluding the only locations that USPS intends, due to cost-cutting, as the effective post offices for small communities, either CPUs or Village Post Offices.
Here is an example: a village post office inside a grocery store in a small village, which is the sole USPS location to serve ZIP 43317. Yeah, it’s small, and it’s not owned by USPS, but it’s all they have, it provides services such as Priority Mail shipping, and USPS lists all its info as it does for US Post Offices. So I agree with Wayzrbill and a few others: we should put the post office category on US Post Offices, Village Post Offices and Contract Postal Units, and nothing else.
As for naming, we should simply name them as the USPS names them. Usually for Post Offices the name has a location identifier such as “US Post Office - Clintonville”. For CPUs and VPOs the name may or may not include CPU or VPO, but we should add in the description that this is what it is, not a full US Post Office
Many grocery stores or convenience stores also sell stamps but should not be listed as post office unless there is the official USPS window.
There should probably be a category for UPS, FEDEX, Pack&Ship Stores. But that is up to staff. Sort of like the Hospital/Urgent Care and the Doctor/Clinic, hopefully this will get fixed eventually.
This makes a lot of sense to me. If they offer virtually all the amenities of your standard rural post office then I see no reason why VPOs shouldn’t be added—they do have ‘post office’ in the name.
The nature of where they’re usually located (halfway to nowhere, BFE, etc.) and the nature of category search (limited radius) means that essentially we’re choosing whether folks in such areas get no results or one result for a search for ‘post office’. I dare say one is better.
I’m not so sure about CPUs though. In my cursory searches around Louisiana and environs, I’ve found a number of VPOs that would be good to add. However, the vast majority of CPUs I found are in urban and urbanized areas which are already well served by actual post offices, and the handful of rural ones I found are within a few miles of a regular post office.
I think it’s safe to say here that almost all regions via PNH have approved this name format:
“Post Office – [Station Name]”
We have not addressed the issue of CPU or VPO and I have not researched it, but I do think it would be helpful to include this designation in the name. The USPS lists a VPO as for example “VPO Edgard” and I don’t think there’s any reason to do any different. “Post Office – VPO Edgard”?
I want to summarize what we know to this point and to see if everyone agrees:
Only USPS locations should be marked as Post Office. That being said, the vast majority of us agree that a Village Post Office should also be included as that may be the only post office within the search radius.
As for CPU’s, as sketch pointed out, and I have now confirmed to be the case in Oklahoma as well, they tend to be in more densely populated areas or near a VPO or full Post Office. I would lean towards NOT including CPU’s in the Post Office Category. If you disagree with this, can you point to a specific CPU that wouldn’t fall in the “is close enough to VPO or PO that it doesn’t need to be listed”?
Naming: Looking over the PNH spreadsheets, it does appear everyone uses the “Post Office - Station Name” format. However, what is the benefit to some regions being AP’s and some being PP’s?
As brought up by XanderB, and I am for this as well, we can use the search at: https://tools.usps.com/go/POLocatorAction!input.action and select the options “Post Offices” and “Village Post Offices”. If the location isn’t in that list, it should NOT have the “Post Office” cagegory.
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