I’m an English editor, not familiar with standards for Finland.
I’ve recently driven on some (very minor) roads which were not on the Waze map. Link. I’ve added them as unpaved streets, but I notice that similar nearby roads are mapped as private roads or narrow roads. You may wish to change my new roads?
I also drove along a third road, which was actually better than the other two (same link) but was mapped as off-road. I’ve changed it to street too, but again you may wish to change this.
Hi, unfortunately we also don’t have clear rules for using NS / PR in these cases. PR is more common, especially when the road has no name. NS acts pretty much the same way in the routing so we haven’t created any clear use cases for that. I’d keep all those as PR’s instead of streets.
Agree. It’s certainly a thing that you get varying responses from other editors. I prefer to categorize small roads as follows:
Street - can be routed through, there are no “isäntä” -guys with axes on the way to tell you to go away
NarrowStreet - Might be routable through, but you usually end up doing u-turns. Also when small streets make a easy routing loop close to Major streets (=if these are marked as streets, Waze doesn’t have to give u-turn instructions, but instead it routes through a small loop). Some say these roads are “invisible” in the waze app, but I don’t share their opinion.
PrivateRoad - can’t be navigated through. Small streets with no name. Roads that lead to houses (“pihatie”), roads that are clearly marked as private roads in nature (“yksityistie”).
Around the Vihtijärvi area, there are really old edits when 4x4 dirt roads were acceptable. Some of those are from really early data imports. Nowadays I think no one is drawing new 4x4 dirt roads anymore. Or only in a certain small exceptions, when you are most certain that a road is only for single farmer with his equipment, but you want to have a proper railroad crossing.
The exception. If you end up with a area with multiple PrivateRoad areas that should be routed through a single “main” road, I’ll categorize that main road as a Street. Once the driver is running on private road, the driver can continue to any private road connected to these private road segments. The driver may not exit private road to street (except it the driver starts to drive from a private road). The most common example is that you have shops on both sides of the public road. These shops have parking lot areas that have multiple entries/exits. If all parking lot roads are marked as parking lot roads, you may start driving from parking lot shop A, then drive through parking lot shop B and only after that enter the public streets - which usually is restricted if you don’t stop in the parking lot shop B.
So if you’re trying to prevent driving through, then you should consider using mix of streets and private roads.
However. If uncertain, please draw the road anyway. A road with wrong properties is always a road -not a missing road. One can fix it later.
When a road is dead-end and there is no alternate routes to the area, then from the routing point of view, the road could be of any drivable class and Waze would still use it in routing. The only practical difference is how they look like in the app. The main reason we use private road and narrow street classes for roads in the rural area is that in the client they show up as very thin lines which should tell anyone who drives without active route that the road is indeed minor or even not maintained.
As the routing algorithm in Waze is based mostly on various sized time penalties, there simply is no easy solution for every mapping problem outside urban areas. When the time penalties start to stack up, suddenly some really weird and long detour might end up being the fastest even if it does not make any sense what-so-ever in the real world.
Don’t worry. We didn’t even start a debate yet. You just saw a three forum-active editors.
As stated, in the wilderness it’s not always so clear should you draw a street or a private road. Usually it shouldn’t be freeway or M/mHW, but in some cases it might be. :lol:
We will keep our eyes open and thanks for informing the changes you have performed.
Well the road type isn’t always so clear in here but thinking about routing is often the key. Road types seen in that area are street, passageway and private road, also all are unpaved. Street provides least resistance (penalty time in routing calculation) to routing so Waze will use it if possible, Passageway doesn’t like to be routed through but will go if no other route within some reasonable distance is possible. Private road is not routed through if other route is possible. I also like to make ending “forest roads” last segments to be either private roads or offroads based on is there any houses or cottages or just wilderness.
So in this case if you would like to go from Kärrintie to Keihäsjärvi you’d end up in route like this seen on Livemap. Just have to keep in mind that app and Livemap use different routing servers so those might not always give the same result.
Anyway, we will discuss these again at some point and try to get some solution
Modified a bit the road classes. They are mostly same level so mixing of street/PR/NR shouldn’t be required. There is one boom on the road according to the MML’s reference map so that’s the only case PR might be required.(unavailable attachment: Screenshot 2022-05-31 at 8.56.06.png)
